INFO-VAX Tue, 17 Apr 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 211 Contents: Re: C++ Garbage Collector on VMS? Re: C++ Garbage Collector on VMS? Re: can you handle this? Re: can you handle this? Re: can you handle this? Re: can you handle this? Re: can you handle this? Re: can you handle this? Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Now I've seen everything Re: Now I've seen everything Re: OT: OpenVMS Problem with BACKUP/LIST/JOU/SINCE/SELECT Re: Problem with BACKUP/LIST/JOU/SINCE/SELECT Re: Problem with BACKUP/LIST/JOU/SINCE/SELECT Re: Sun shows Rock first silicon Re: TCPIP SMTP: suggestion Re: TCPIP SMTP: suggestion Re: TCPIP SMTP: suggestion Woooooooooooooooooow The Best Music Search Engine ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 21:45:15 -0500 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: C++ Garbage Collector on VMS? Message-ID: <462434BB.B2A05EAD@spam.comcast.net> Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson wrote: > > Hi all, > > I've been trying to find out if the Boehm GC works on VMS, and have so > far not found anything, except a mention of a porting attempt from > 1995 (this group, google). > > Is there a garbage collector for C++ that works on VMS? I have to ask: Why does a programming language (other than an interpretive environment) need a "garbage collector"??!! -- David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems http://www.djesys.com/ Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/ Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/ Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 22:52:35 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: C++ Garbage Collector on VMS? Message-ID: <4624364a$0$90269$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> David J Dachtera wrote: > Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson wrote: >> I've been trying to find out if the Boehm GC works on VMS, and have so >> far not found anything, except a mention of a porting attempt from >> 1995 (this group, google). >> >> Is there a garbage collector for C++ that works on VMS? > > I have to ask: Why does a programming language (other than an interpretive > environment) need a "garbage collector"??!! Because programmers are notorious for forgetting to deallocate. Arne ------------------------------ Date: 16 Apr 2007 18:03:20 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: can you handle this? Message-ID: <58hs37F2gab1uU1@mid.individual.net> In article <4623B5E7.80802@comcast.net>, "Richard B. gilbert" writes: > Bill Todd wrote: >> Richard B. gilbert wrote: >> >> ... >> >>> "Ours is an age when ignorance has come into its own and one man's >>> opinion is as good as anther's!" Robert Anson Heinlein >> >> >> What a marvelous quote, and from 1963, no less. Heinlein always was >> well ahead of his time ("If This Goes On" - if that's his story about >> fundamentalist-style religion taking over the U.S. - was another of many). >> >> "Glory Road" is one of the few Heinlein novels I've never read. >> >> - bill > > That omission should not be impossible to remedy, even at this late date. > > Heinlein was a writer who could question almost anything, offend almost > everyone, and make you like it! > "Keep Them Rolling!" bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 11:32:33 -0700 From: "John Gemignani, Jr." Subject: Re: can you handle this? Message-ID: "Andrew" wrote in message news:1176742136.612805.292390@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com... > On 16 Apr, 17:42, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon > Clubley) wrote: >> In article <1176734423.795669.75...@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>, >> "Andrew" writes: >> >> >> >> > Trywww.classmates.com >> >> Thank you for the pointer Andrew, but it appears to require registration. >> >> (I had wanted to ask Bob some questions that would hopefully make him >> start to realise just how extreme his views appeared to be coming across >> as, but COV is _not_ the place to ask those questions.) >> >> Simon. >> >> -- >> Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP >> Microsoft: Bringing you 1980's technology to a 21st century world > > Yes sadly it does and not having graduated from a college in the US > limits my scope in terms of registration. > > Regards > Andrew > Maybe someone could bestow an honorary degree upon you? Perhaps The Wizard? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 21:41:27 -0500 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: can you handle this? Message-ID: <462433D7.6409751A@spam.comcast.net> genius@marblecliff.com wrote: > > On Apr 16, 10:40 am, "Andrew" wrote: > > On 13 Apr, 13:18, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon > > > > > > > > > > > > Clubley) wrote: > > > In article <1176433286.892632.31...@y80g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, gen...@marblecliff.com writes: > > > > that evolution has been exposed as the lie it is ... > > > > > > click on this link if you want answers ... > > > > > >http://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/qa.asp > > > > > One more time Bob, > > > > > Will you publish a valid email address so that those of us who wish to > > > discuss this with you have the option of taking it to email instead of > > > cluttering up COV. > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > Simon. > > > > > -- > > > Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP > > > Microsoft: Bringing you 1980's technology to a 21st century world > > > > Trywww.classmates.com > > > > Regards > > Andrew Harrison- Hide quoted text - > > > > - Show quoted text - > > try and try and try again Andrew ... all emails I have go > nowhere ... you will only be talking to Mr Bitbucket ... ...which leads one to question what you're hiding from. ...or are your off-the-wall postings coming back to haunt you? -- David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems http://www.djesys.com/ Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/ Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/ Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ ------------------------------ Date: 16 Apr 2007 19:58:14 -0700 From: David B Sneddon Subject: Re: can you handle this? Message-ID: <1176778694.349667.307150@w1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> On Apr 13, 3:01 am, gen...@marblecliff.com wrote: > that evolution has been exposed as the lie it is ... > > click on this link if you want answers ... > > http://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/qa.asp Sorry Boob but that is the wrong link if you want answers, try this one http://home.austarnet.com.au/stear/ Dave ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 01:08:35 -0400 From: Dave Froble Subject: Re: can you handle this? Message-ID: <6uqdnenvKtOay7nbnZ2dnUVZ_jydnZ2d@libcom.com> Simon Clubley wrote: > In article <1176734423.795669.75190@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com>, "Andrew" writes: >> Try www.classmates.com >> > > Thank you for the pointer Andrew, but it appears to require registration. > > (I had wanted to ask Bob some questions that would hopefully make him > start to realise just how extreme his views appeared to be coming across > as, but COV is _not_ the place to ask those questions.) > > Simon. > Forget it Simon. His mouth works, but his ears don't. -- David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com DFE Ultralights, Inc. 170 Grimplin Road Vanderbilt, PA 15486 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 01:13:10 -0400 From: Dave Froble Subject: Re: can you handle this? Message-ID: <6uqdnejvKtOEyrnbnZ2dnUVZ_jydnZ2d@libcom.com> Bill Todd wrote: > Richard B. gilbert wrote: > > ... > >> "Ours is an age when ignorance has come into its own and one man's >> opinion is as good as anther's!" Robert Anson Heinlein > > What a marvelous quote, and from 1963, no less. Heinlein always was > well ahead of his time ("If This Goes On" - if that's his story about > fundamentalist-style religion taking over the U.S. - was another of many). > > "Glory Road" is one of the few Heinlein novels I've never read. > > - bill Glory Road was one of my favorites. And I liked them all, so that's saying something. -- David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com DFE Ultralights, Inc. 170 Grimplin Road Vanderbilt, PA 15486 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 16:24:45 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Message-ID: Bob Koehler wrote: > Due to an ANSI C interpretation the C RTL will now remap a C exit > code of 0 to SS$_NORMAL (1) before DCL gets it unless told not to. Many thanks for this. I would have never learnt this. This can be of interest when writing quick/dirty programs that test something and thene xit with various values. (eg: exit(0) will come out as exit(1), so you better not use "0" as exit code for your utilities since you'll get a wring status code). ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 15:41:09 -0500 (CDT) From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Message-ID: <07041615410965_202002DA@antinode.org> From: JF Mezei > Bob Koehler wrote: > > Due to an ANSI C interpretation the C RTL will now remap a C exit > > code of 0 to SS$_NORMAL (1) before DCL gets it unless told not to. > > > Many thanks for this. I would have never learnt this. Why not? alp $ help crtl exit * [...] o A status value of 0 or EXIT_SUCCESS is translated to the OpenVMS SS$_NORMAL status code to return the OpenVMS success value. [...] > This can be of > interest when writing quick/dirty programs that test something and thene > xit with various values. (eg: exit(0) will come out as exit(1), so you > better not use "0" as exit code for your utilities since you'll get a > wring status code). See also _POSIX_EXIT, described nearby. I'd bet that this stuff is also covered in the C RTL documentation. Where's the mystery? Assuming that "wring" was supposed to be "wrong", what's wrong about exit(0) causing an exit with a success status? How much UNIX incompatibility would you like? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Steven M. Schweda sms@antinode-org 382 South Warwick Street (+1) 651-699-9818 Saint Paul MN 55105-2547 ------------------------------ Date: 16 Apr 2007 16:08:21 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Message-ID: In article <07041615410965_202002DA@antinode.org>, sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) writes: > From: JF Mezei > >> Bob Koehler wrote: >> > Due to an ANSI C interpretation the C RTL will now remap a C exit >> > code of 0 to SS$_NORMAL (1) before DCL gets it unless told not to. >> >> >> Many thanks for this. I would have never learnt this. > > Why not? I guess JF never reads the Release Notes. Fascinating things, they tell you about such changes. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 17:56:59 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Message-ID: <1af7c$4623f160$cef8887a$556@TEKSAVVY.COM> Steven M. Schweda wrote: > I'd bet that this stuff is also covered in the C RTL documentation. > Where's the mystery? Because it used to be possible to exit with a status of 0 (probably with vaxC). ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 18:24:40 -0500 (CDT) From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Message-ID: <07041618244051_202002DA@antinode.org> From: JF Mezei > Because it used to be possible to exit with a status of 0 (probably with > vaxC). alp $ type ets.c #include main() { sys$exit( 0); } alp $ cc ets alp $ link ets alp $ r ets %NONAME-W-NOMSG, Message number 00000000 It's not entirely obvious to me why any rational person would prefer this behavior. > [...] How much UNIX > incompatibility would you like? Still waiting ... ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Steven M. Schweda sms@antinode-org 382 South Warwick Street (+1) 651-699-9818 Saint Paul MN 55105-2547 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 22:17:39 -0500 (CDT) From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: Re: Error Checking in DCL using $severity Message-ID: <07041622173964_202002DA@antinode.org> From: Ken Fairfield > Calling sys$exit with zero as its argument is far different > then using "return 0;". [...] I know that, which would have been obvious if I had directed the following to the group (as I thought that I had, but apparently hadn't), instead of to the individual (REP/EXT v. FOR/EDI -- Sigh): From: JF Mezei > > I'd bet that this stuff is also covered in the C RTL documentation. > > Where's the mystery? > > Because it used to be possible to exit with a status of 0 (probably with > vaxC). WIMP $ type et.c #include main() { exit( 0); } WIMP $ cc et WIMP $ link et, SYS$SHARE:VAXCRTL /libr WIMP $ run et WIMP $ write sys$output $status %X00000001 WIMP $ write sys$output f$getsyi( "version") V5.4 WIMP $ cc /list = tt: /noobje nl: INPUTFILE 16-APR-2007 17:5 8:20 VAX C V3.1-051 Page 1 V1.0 17-NOV-1858 00:0 0:00 NL:[]INPUTFILE.C; (1) [...] VAXC031_IGUIDE.TXT: [...] December 1989 [...] release notes before or after installing the product. This document applies to VAX C Version 3.1. [...] Yeah, I can see how something like this could sneak up on a person. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Steven M. Schweda sms@antinode-org 382 South Warwick Street (+1) 651-699-9818 Saint Paul MN 55105-2547 ------------------------------ Date: 16 Apr 2007 10:52:51 -0700 From: "Neil Rieck" Subject: Now I've seen everything Message-ID: <1176745971.308675.247850@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com> Last night on TLC the boys from American Chopper received a phone call from HP. It seems that the boys down in Houston want to have an HP- Themed chopper built for some such reason. Was it a set-up when Paul Sr. smashed a working PC then stepped on it and found that it still worked? I don't know but I now can die in peace because I have seen everything. Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge, Ontario, Canada. http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/ . ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 21:48:53 -0500 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: Now I've seen everything Message-ID: <46243595.73FFD375@spam.comcast.net> Neil Rieck wrote: > > Last night on TLC the boys from American Chopper received a phone call > from HP. It seems that the boys down in Houston want to have an HP- > Themed chopper built for some such reason. Was it a set-up when Paul > Sr. smashed a working PC then stepped on it and found that it still > worked? I don't know but I now can die in peace because I have seen > everything. Well, not quite everything. You haven't seen: o A full-page ad in the mainstream media for anything running on or related to OpenVMS-I64 o An I64 SuperDome that can outperform an Alpha EV7z GS1280 o A lucid, reasonable post from Boob. -- David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems http://www.djesys.com/ Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/ Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/ Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 16:18:12 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: OT: OpenVMS Message-ID: <4623d9db$0$90269$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Bill Todd wrote: > Arne Vajhøj wrote: >> I do not see any reason to believe this group would >> be dead if there were only on topic posts. > > Ah - perhaps you are arithmetically-challenged, then. Please post the arithmetic, then we can see. Arne ------------------------------ Date: 16 Apr 2007 13:31:09 -0700 From: "AEF" Subject: Problem with BACKUP/LIST/JOU/SINCE/SELECT Message-ID: <1176755468.789838.152730@d57g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> $ BACK/LIS/JOU=STOR-2007/SINC=1-APR-2007/SELE=BITMAP Listing of BACKUP journal Journal file SYS$SYSDEVICE:[FELDMAN.BACKUP]STOR-2007.BJL;1 on 16- APR-2007 21:29:13.63 Save set STOR-070131.IMG created on 31-JAN-2007 10:12:32.08 Volume number 1, volume label STOR50 [000000]BITMAP.SYS;1 file header only Save set STOR-070302.IMG created on 2-MAR-2007 20:37:59.84 Volume number 1, volume label STOR50 [000000]BITMAP.SYS;1 file header only . . . VMS V6.2 OK, what am I doing wrong? It works fine for /BEFORE, but seems to completely ignore /SINCE. Thanks! AEF ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 21:52:30 -0500 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: Problem with BACKUP/LIST/JOU/SINCE/SELECT Message-ID: <4624366E.D0C3E1A1@spam.comcast.net> AEF wrote: > > $ BACK/LIS/JOU=STOR-2007/SINC=1-APR-2007/SELE=BITMAP > Listing of BACKUP journal > Journal file SYS$SYSDEVICE:[FELDMAN.BACKUP]STOR-2007.BJL;1 on 16- > APR-2007 21:29:13.63 > > Save set STOR-070131.IMG created on 31-JAN-2007 10:12:32.08 > Volume number 1, volume label STOR50 > [000000]BITMAP.SYS;1 file header only > > Save set STOR-070302.IMG created on 2-MAR-2007 20:37:59.84 > Volume number 1, volume label STOR50 > [000000]BITMAP.SYS;1 file header only > . > . > . > > VMS V6.2 > > OK, what am I doing wrong? It works fine for /BEFORE, but seems to > completely ignore /SINCE. First guess time: BACKUP knows that BITMAP.SYS is part of the file system and saving restoring it ... actually, I dunno why I would want to do that. A little more background may be useful... -- David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems http://www.djesys.com/ Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/ Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/ Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ ------------------------------ Date: 16 Apr 2007 20:09:24 -0700 From: David B Sneddon Subject: Re: Problem with BACKUP/LIST/JOU/SINCE/SELECT Message-ID: <1176779363.994948.262200@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com> On Apr 16, 8:31 pm, "AEF" wrote: > $ BACK/LIS/JOU=STOR-2007/SINC=1-APR-2007/SELE=BITMAP > Listing of BACKUP journal > Journal file SYS$SYSDEVICE:[FELDMAN.BACKUP]STOR-2007.BJL;1 on 16- > APR-2007 21:29:13.63 > > Save set STOR-070131.IMG created on 31-JAN-2007 10:12:32.08 > Volume number 1, volume label STOR50 > [000000]BITMAP.SYS;1 file header only > > Save set STOR-070302.IMG created on 2-MAR-2007 20:37:59.84 > Volume number 1, volume label STOR50 > [000000]BITMAP.SYS;1 file header only > . > . > . > > VMS V6.2 > > OK, what am I doing wrong? It works fine for /BEFORE, but seems to > completely ignore /SINCE. > > Thanks! > > AEF You are using /SINCE. Which date field is BACKUP using for the comparison? You have not specified one. Dave ------------------------------ Date: 16 Apr 2007 16:30:47 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Sun shows Rock first silicon Message-ID: In article <4622086e$0$16392$88260bb3@free.teranews.com>, "Neil Rieck" writes: > ### > "Rock is 16 cores - we haven't said how many threads per core. Nor have we > said why this chip heralds the golden age of effortless parallel > programming, or how it brings fault tolerance to the masses. But stay tuned, > I think we're planning on talking up both in the next few weeks." > > In the past, we've disclosed that Rock will run two threads per core, giving > it 32 threads per chip. In addition, the 256TB of memory described by > Schwartz would come via a 8-socket box that holds 512 DIMMs, depicted here. > Our sources have indicated that Sun stopped work on systems any larger than > the Platinum box. > > ### But do they have a compiler than can provide "effortless parallel programming"? When I looked at generated code I was impressed what DEC's compilers would do for parallel operations on 21064 (two threads). But most of the Sun users I've worked with just grab the gnu compilers. I'm not holding my breath waiting for gcc to keep 32 threads busy. Can I convince my Sun users to buy a professionally written compiler, and if so, what assurances do I get that it will keep 32 threads busy, or do I have to make sure I have 16 active processes to keep the 16 cores busy? Anything less is just more marketing instructions per second. I got enough NOPs running on my Pentium M. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 20:57:24 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: TCPIP SMTP: suggestion Message-ID: In article <2kyUh.57854$oV.3049@attbi_s21>, "John E. Malmberg" writes: > Read the spamhaus description of the pbl zone component. The pbl zone > only contains DHCP ranges where the ISP has told spamhaus.org to block > it. It can also contain non-DHCP ranges that spamhaus.org has > determined to be extremely unlikely to ever send legitimate e-mail and > apparently the network owner does not respond to any outside contact for > either spam/abuse complaints or other requests. The last point is the crucial one for me. Suppose a user sends a legitimate email, then someone else in the block of IP addresses assigned to that provider sends spam (perhaps even from the same dynamic IP address after it has been assigned to someone else) and that the provider doesn't respond to complaints (which, of course, he should); SpamHouse would then put that whole block of IPs on the list, thus punishing the legitimate user. Yes, in the long run it might be better if the legitimate user moves to another provider, but probably such a person sending email directly is not very tech-savvy and wouldn't understand the reason to move and/or send email through a trusted server. I do realise that much spam comes from such IP addresses. The question is whether to throw the (just one) baby out with the whole ocean of (very dirty) bathwater. With just sbl and xbl (and not pbl), spam dropped from about 150 to 100 per day. (The total number of spams is several hundred per day, but most of those are to non-existent users and setting symbiont-checks-deliverability to false stops most of those (i.e. those which are syntactically valid usernames; I think this has been fixed in a newer version of TCPIP). > And again, essentially as far as I can tell, if you are still > deliberately accepting e-mail from known DHCP zones, then you are one of > a decreasing group. That's certainly true. > If one of the widely used commercial DHCP blocking list was as up to > date as the free ones, those few people still attempting to run mail > servers on DHCP lists would probably find only a handful of mail servers > accepting their e-mail. True. > If the spamhaus pbl zone is up to date on DHCP zones that their ISPs > which I know of that prohibit servers on DHCP addresses, then as the zen > or pbl zone gets adopted more, those few people attempting to run a mail > server on a DHCP address will find almost no one accepting their e-mail. > Either because of the adoption of the zen/pbl zone, or that this serious > competition will force the commercial service to get its act together. Yes. > The sbl.spamhaus.org and the dul.dnsbl.sorbs.net are probably stable > enough for a daily or so update to a local copy via rsync or other > suitable protocol. list.dsbl.org also takes 24 hours to process a > removal, so getting a copy once a day can also reduce network queries. I just put them in the SMTP.CONFIG, so presumably they are queried. > I would recommend that you look carefully at what each blocking list > does, and also keep statistics about how much each of them rejects. That's why I started out with just one, to see its effect. Alas, I don't think HP TCPIP 5.4 will log WHICH RBL an address matched. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 21:17:36 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: TCPIP SMTP: suggestion Message-ID: In article , moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) writes: > I get enough backscatter bounces from > Russian IPs that SYS$SPECIFIC:[TCPIP$SMTP]TCPIP$SMTP_RECV_RUN.LOG has > reached version ;32767 a few times. I now have a nightly batch job which renumbers the files. :-( > I don't take this to extremes and > >don't mind violating the RFCs if, for example, I don't send a bounce > >message when I should if I am sure that the mail is spam (and that such > >a message would have no positive effect, even if it reached the > >spammer). > > Despite the RFCs, that's what you should be doing. It is important that > you try to reject as much spam during the SMTP session rather than > accepting it and either bouncing it (floods innocents) or having it > just vanishing so the sender never knows it was never delivered, if legit. That IS what I do. By "bounce" I mean first accepting the mail and then having the Postmaster send a mail to the (probably forged) sender that it couldn't be delivered. Better, as you say, is to reject it (with an error message) RATHER THAN accepting it. > Too bad it doesn't work like DECnet email. With that, when you see the > MAIL> prompt after sending to a (DECnet) address, you know for a fact > that it is either in the recipients mailbox (no error from send) or > you know for a fact it wasn't delivered due to the error causing the > message above the MAIL> prompt. Of course, if ALL the world ran on VMS, many things would be much better. :-| ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 18:08:30 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: TCPIP SMTP: suggestion Message-ID: <1f646$4623f415$cef8887a$1722@TEKSAVVY.COM> Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: > SpamHouse would then put that whole block of IPs on the list, thus > punishing the legitimate user. Yes, in the long run it might be better > if the legitimate user moves to another provider, but probably such a > person sending email directly is not very tech-savvy and wouldn't > understand the reason to move and/or send email through a trusted > server. You also do not want to receive any emails from a dynamic IP since the headers will contain an IP that is meaningless and you cannot do any of your own investigation/testing on it since by the time you want to investigate that header, that IP may no longer have that SMTP server attached to it. (Consider debugging issues with illformed headers, or wanting to seach your logs after a complaint that a message was not delivered. If everytime the sender uses a different IP, it becomes harder to debug). > With just sbl and xbl (and not pbl), spam dropped from about 150 to 100 > per day. try zen and see how much your volume drops. And remember that since most people block emails from dynamic IPs, if you use a dynamic IP, your own messages will likely be blocked. > That's why I started out with just one, to see its effect. Alas, I > don't think HP TCPIP 5.4 will log WHICH RBL an address matched. No, it doesn't log which rbl matched. That is something which should not only be logged, but also the message sent to the sender should also include which rbl his IP is included in as a courtesy for legitimate senders who may accidentally be on such a list. ------------------------------ Date: 16 Apr 2007 14:41:06 -0700 From: "ggbbs028@126.com" Subject: Woooooooooooooooooow The Best Music Search Engine Message-ID: <1176759666.492703.183370@y80g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> http://www.freemp3sky.com ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.211 ************************