CHAPTER VAX PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Editor's Workfile . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . VAX-3 Another Classic Moment in Support . . . . . . . VAX-3 Far Out VAX/VMS Futures . . . . . . . . . . . . VAX-5 LUG News . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . VAX-7 IOCASE: An I/O Function Code Dispatch Macro . . VAX-8 Network Security Working Group Formed . . . . VAX-12 Digital Responds to the Fall 1987 SIR Ballot . VAX-14 A Daily Maintenance Procedure . . . . . . . . VAX-23 VAX/VMS Security . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . VAX-27 INPUT/OUTPUT . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . VAX-29 Forms at the End System Improvement Request Submission Form . . VAX-100 VAX Systems SIG Spring 1988 SIR Ballot . . . . VAX-102 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 To register for on-line submission to the Pageswapper dial: (617) 262-6830 (in the United States) using a 1200 baud modem and log in with the username PAGESWAPPER. Articles for publication in the Pageswapper can be sent (US mail only -- no "express" services please) to: Larry Kilgallen, PAGESWAPPER Editor Box 81, MIT Station Cambridge, MA 02139-0901 USA Preference is given to material submitted as machine-readable text (best is Runoff source). Line length should not exceed 64 characters and the number of text lines per page should not exceed 48 (these limits are particularly important for sample commands, etc. where simple text justification will not produce a meaningful result). Please do not submit program source, as that is better distributed on the VAX SIG tape. Please do not submit "slides" from DECUS Symposia presentations (or other meetings) as they are generally a very incomplete treatment for those readers of the Pageswapper who are not so fortunate as to be able to travel to Symposia. Please DO write articles based on such slides to get the content across to a wider audience than is able to attend. Change of address, reports of non-receipt, and other circulation correspondence should be sent to: DECUS U.S. Chapter Attention: Publications Department 249 Northboro Road (BPO2) Marlborough, MA 01752 USA Only if discrepancies of the mailing system are reported can they be analyzed and corrected. VAX-2 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Editor's Workfile Editor's Workfile SIR Voting Time April 8 is the deadline for voting on the Spring 1988 System Improvement Request ballot. If you really are reading this issue the first day of March, there might be a chance that you will get around to reading the April issue in time to be reminded, but don't count on it. Vote now -- the form is in this issue, but you will have to go to the February issue for the text of SIRs (SIR voting can also be done on-line by those with Pageswapper submission accounts). Another Classic Moment in Support ================================================================ Note 888.0 Another SPR classic 2 replies "Kevin Angley" 18 lines 25-JAN-1988 13:10 ---------------------------------------------------------------- I submitted an SPR recently that the status of a volume shadowed disk returned by GETDVI sometimes was incorrect. The answer that I got (from the "screening" team) was: The GETDVI lexical and GETDVI system service does not work on a cluster. More specifically, NO function of GETDVI is supported on a cluster. It is an "undocumented restriction". That this system service doesn't work is "the intended behaviour". They will "consider my suggestion" that a very critical and commonly used system service be fixed. VAX-3 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Another Classic Moment in Support Your software support dollars at work! Kevin Angley 3301 Terminal Drive Raleigh, NC 27604 ================================================================ Note 888.1 Another SPR classic 1 of 2 "Steve Duff" 4 lines 26-JAN-1988 01:02 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Is that to mean that $GETDVI isn't supported when -used- in a cluster, or "merely" that $GETDVI isn't supported for cluster devices? In either case, one is certainly to wonder what all those cluster-info item codes are doing in $GETDVI . Steve Duff Software Factory 2401 E. 17th St. Suite 190 Santa Ana, Ca. 92701 ================================================================ Note 888.2 Another SPR classic 2 of 2 "Kevin Angley" 11 lines 26-JAN-1988 15:36 -< What she said was >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- I tried to get them to say that what they really meant was that GETDVI would not work ACROSS a cluster (i.e. to tell you information about a device attached to another node). But she reiterated ... GETDVI is not supported on a system that is part of a cluster. Obviously, they could refine this restriction. But since they are DEC and we are just customers, and they are not going to document this restriction anyway, why lift a finger to help out the software support customer who is shelling out dollars (but not for long)? Kevin Angley 3301 Terminal Drive Raleigh, NC 27604 VAX-4 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Far Out VAX/VMS Futures Far Out VAX/VMS Futures By Ray Kaplan PIVOTAL, Inc. P.O. Box 32647 Tucson, Arizona 85751-32647 VMS Engineering at DEC has a new advanced development group. As you might guess, they are interested in what DECUS has to say about where VMS might be in the far distant future. Here is your chance to give 'em some ideas. This is not the stuff that System Improvement Requests (SIRs) are made of, as typically SIRs are more "short term" in nature. The advanced development group is interested in where VMS should be in a few years, and not interested in what new qualifiers and utilities anyone wants for the next minor or major release. If you have not taken the time to fill out an SIR form, please take a moment now to locate it in the back of this issue of the newsletter and consider filling it out with your ideas for what VMS should be in the short term. Recently, one of the VMS product managers came to a national Symposium to report that well over 85% of the SIRs had been implemented over the years. This means that WE (as users of the VAX SIG's SIR process) really do have an impact on the future of VMS. Mark Oakley (Battelle in Columbus Ohio) does a bang up job of managing the SIR process. He can't do it by himself though! Pitch in and give him some input, won't you? But what of the VMS advanced development group's interests in where VMS should be in 1992? Toward the end of developing a flow good ideas into the group, I got a Birds of Feather session scheduled at the just past Anaheim Symposium. We started off just brainstorming around the idea that whatever was presented should be as far reaching in its effect on VMS as VAXclusters have just as much architectural significance to VMS. I guess that the thought here is that it takes years to integrate a major new architectural concept into VMS. VAX-5 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Far Out VAX/VMS Futures Further clarifying our objectives, we came up with several categories to help us think about things that make sense for long term VMS directions. Here are the categories that we discussed and some of the things that we came up for each one: Architectural refinements that were discussed included things like better definitions of layers and classes, "de-PDP-11-izing" things, associative memory support, high level languages that produce processor-specific microcode, and better I/O processing like DECnet on a board and file servers. Problem spaces (problems yet to be solved) included mention of addressing the challenge of the 2 or 3 order of magnitude increase in the number of VAXes out there, and better realtime support. Solution spaces (solutions waiting to be applied) included discussion of support for object oriented and database primitives and for distributed operating system support. In the "what to build" category there were things like checkpointing support, transaction oriented primitive support, movable process contexts (network and cluster) and a timely Internals and Data Structures Manual. Perhaps you can use these ideas a guide when you consider ideas about where VMS might go in the future. Please take some time to think about where VMS might go in the future and take a moment to mail them to me (address at the top of this article). We agreed that there should be a Pageswapper article and that we should schedule a Symposium session for Cincinnati. This is the Pageswapper article, and the session that we submitted for Cincinnati has the title of "VMS Architectural Suggestions". The rest is up to you. Mail your suggestions or come to the Cincinnati session, but don't just do nothing! (How's that for a double negative? At least, I got your attention?) VAX-6 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 LUG News LUG News Meeting topics for March - from respective LUG Newsletters St Louis Local User's Group Second Tuesday of every month at the Salad Bowl Restaurant 3949 Lindell Boulevard 5:30 pm - social time 6:00 pm - dinner 7:00 pm - program March - Workstations - Tom Kelly, Digital MIVAXLUG Lawrence Institute of Technology Management Building, Room M336 10-Mile Road Southfield, MI 6:15 Open Steering Committee meeting 7:00 Main Meeting March 8 - Security The January 1988 issue of the MIVAXLUG Newsletter reports that of the 7100 people attending the Fall Symposium in Anaheim, 30 had an IBM affiliation. DFWLUG TDIndustries Stemmons Freeway Dallas, Texas 7:00 pm March 8 Andrea Arthur of Software Conversion Systems in Milford, Connecticut will discuss "On-Line Transaction Processing with a Hint of ACMS". VAX-7 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 IOCASE: An I/O Function Code Dispatch Macro IOCASE: An I/O Function Code Dispatch Macro Lawrence M. Baker U. S. Geological Survey 345 Middlefield Road MS977 Menlo Park, CA 94025 In the course of modifying DEC's XADRIVER, I have found it useful to be able to dispatch to the appropriate Start I/O entry points using a CASE instruction in place of several CMPB...BEQL or CMPB...BNEQ...BRW instruction sequences. I found the overhead for the CASE instruction to be equivalent to about three or four comparisons in the dispatching code sequence -- roughly the same as before making the change. The main benefit is improved appearance and easier modification of the driver (since I was no longer forced to modify the dispatching code when CMPB...BEQL's no longer reached their destination). It was still a pain to look up the values for the I/O Function Codes I needed, and to build the CASE branch table by hand, so I wrote a macro, IOCASE, which does all the work for me. It takes a source operand for use as an index into a branch table (using word context, by default), which is built from a list of pairs, similar to those used in the Function Decision Table entry point macro, FUNCTAB, at the top of a device driver. The macro also automatically detects illegal and duplicate I/O Function Codes. The branch table is built using the fewest possible entries, and control passes to the instruction following IOCASE if the source operand does not correspond to one of the I/O Function Codes specified. Disclaimer Although this program has been tested by the Geological Survey, United States Department of the Interior, no warranty, expressed or implied, is made by the Geological Survey as to the accuracy and functioning of the program and related program material nor shall the fact of distribution constitute any such warranty, and no responsibility is assumed by the Geological Survey in connection therewith. VAX-8 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 IOCASE: An I/O Function Code Dispatch Macro IOCase.mar .Title IOCase .Ident /V1.0/ ; ; IOCase.mar implements a CASE construct indexed by I/O Function ; Code. It is particularly useful in the Start I/O section of a ; device driver. ; ; (Note: IOCase requires that the $IODef macro be specified to ; define the I/O Function Codes at assembly time, rather than at ; link time.) ; ; IOCase src,addrlist[,type=W] ; ; src ; Source of the index value to be used with the CASE ; instruction. ; ; addrlist ; A list containing one or more specifications of the ; following format: ; ; ; ; For each pair, destination specifies the address to ; which control is to be transferred, depending on the ; value of the I/O Function Code. ; ; [type=W] ; Data type of src (B, W, or L). ; ; ; For example, the following code excerpt: ; ; EXTZV #IO$V_FCODE,#IO$S_FCODE,- ; Extract I/O function ; IRP$W_FUNC(R3),R2 ; code(sans modifiers) ; CMPB #IO$_READPBLK,R2 ; Read request? ; BEQL DO_READPBLK ; CMPB #IO$_WRITEPBLK,R2 ; Write request? ; BEQL DO_WRITEPBLK ; BRW DO_SETCHAR ; Must be set ; ; characteristics ; ; can be replaced with: ; ; EXTZV #IO$V_FCODE,#IO$S_FCODE,- ; Extract I/O function VAX-9 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 IOCASE: An I/O Function Code Dispatch Macro ; IRP$W_FUNC(R3),R2 ; code(sans modifiers) ; IOCASE R2,<- ; ,- ; Read request ; ,-; Write request ; - ; Set characteristics ; >,B ; .Macro IOCase,Src,AddrList,Type=W,?Base,?Top ; Validate_IOFunc first checks that the I/O function code is in ; range, makes sure there are no duplicates, then updates the ; minimum and maximum I/O function codes found .Macro Validate_IOFunc,IOFunc,Dest .IIf LT, ,- .Error ; Invalid I/O function code .If GE 31-IO$_'IOFunc IOFunc_Mask = 1@IO$_'IOFunc .IIf NE, ,- .Error ; Duplicate I/O function code Valid_IOFunc_Lo = Valid_IOFunc_Lo ! IOFunc_Mask .IfF ; GE 31-IO$_'IOFunc IOFunc_Mask = 1@ .IIf NE, ,- .Error ; Duplicate I/O function code Valid_IOFunc_Hi = Valid_IOFunc_Hi ! IOFunc_Mask .EndC ; GE 31-IO$_'IOFunc .IIf GT, , Min_IOFunc = IO$_'IOFunc .IIf LT, , Max_IOFunc = IO$_'IOFunc .EndM ; IOFunc_Slot inserts the signed word offset to the destination ; address into the CASE instruction branch table, indexed by the ; offset of the I/O function code from the minimum I/O function ; code found .Macro IOFunc_Slot,IOFunc,Dest . = 2* + Base .Signed_Word Dest-Base .EndM ; Initialize the duplicate I/O function code bitmaps, and the ; minimum and maximum I/O function codes found Valid_IOFunc_Lo = 0 Valid_IOFunc_Hi = 0 VAX-10 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 IOCASE: An I/O Function Code Dispatch Macro Min_IOFunc = IO$M_FCode Max_IOFunc = 0 ; For each I/O function code/destination pair, validate the ; I/O function code and update the minimum and maximum I/O ; function codes found .IRp Pair, Validate_IOFunc Pair .EndR ; Emit a CASE instruction with the appropriate operand access, ; followed by a branch table pre-filled to fall through if src ; is an unspecified I/O function code Case'Type Src,#Min_IOFunc,#Max_IOFunc Base: .Rept Max_IOFunc - Min_IOFunc + 1 .Signed_Word Top-Base ; Pre-fill the table to fall ; through .EndR Top: .IRp Pair, IOFunc_Slot Pair ; Fill in the table entries ; specified .EndR . = Top .EndM VAX-11 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Network Security Working Group Formed Network Security Working Group Formed By Ray Kaplan PIVOTAL, Inc. P.O. Box 32647 Tucson, Arizona 85751-32647 During the VAX SIG Security Working Group meeting at the Nashville Symposia, several of us decided that we would like to see a Pre-Symposium seminar on network security. Ken Coar and I went off and created such a seminar, and successfully presented it at the Anaheim Symposium. It is entitled "An Introduction to DECnet-VAX Security". While it was a little rough, it did meet its objectives in providing complete coverage of the subject. At this writing, we are planning to continue to offer the seminar and to improve it as we can. We hope to get it together to take advantage of DEC's kind offer of a demo system in Cincinnati. As it was in Anaheim, we couldn't get it together to do anything but a few simple demos like MAIL and PHONE network object abuses. J.D. (Dave) MacPherson (DECUS NLC Southwest Regional LUG Coordinator) joined us in our efforts to demonstrate active and passive tapping, but we just didn't have it together to take advantage of DEC's kind offer of help. We hope to demonstrate both active and passive tapping in Cincinnati. After several months of poking around inside of DECUS leadership to find a home for this interest in network security, I gave up hunting and hung it inside of the VAX SIG for the time being. In Anaheim we had a Network Security Working Group formation meeting that was attended by a handful of interested folks, but no one from the Network SIG came. There has been considerable interest in network security of late, especially since the German computer club break-ins over the SPAN network. Interestingly enough, the attendance at the meeting was well balanced between DEC, commercial enterprises, not-for-profit enterprises, and the Department of Defense. The combined attendance was energetic in defining several things that it wanted to see happen. VAX-12 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Network Security Working Group Formed We identified two more Pre-Symposium seminars that we want to see. They are "X.25 and Internet Security", and "Trusted Networks". Due to the short time deadline for getting things submitted for Cincinnati and DECUS politics we could not get them going just yet. Maybe for Anaheim (Fall 1988). We identified several Symposium sessions, and have submitted them for scheduling. They include "You think you've been hit, now what?", and "How to protect your DECnet" and "Trusted networks, the Red Book". We were unsuccessful in getting a panel discussion between the DOD, DEC, and some users of various types (commercial and non-commercial) submitted for scheduling this time. Maybe next time. Several people signed up to work on a newsletter article on some aspect of network security, and a one-person task force has been signed up to seek out liaisons with security officers at various sites for the purposes of starting up a dialog with them about network security. We even want to start a network security war story collection. As you can see, we did a lot given that we only have a handful of people there. As you might guess, it all will grind to a halt unless folks like you pitch in and participate. At this writing, Ken Coar, some of the folks who came to the working group meeting and myself are planning to do the DECnet-VAX PRE-SYMPOSIUM SEMINAR again in Cincinnati. Several people have volunteered to work on the Symposium sessions that we are going to try to do for Cincinnati. Beyond that, everything else that happens is going to be a direct result of people like you getting actively involved. I plan to make at least one mailing to everyone whose name I have between now and Cincinnati. Beyond all of the above, I can't do much more to get things going. If you want to be on the mailing list, drop me a line. If you have an interest in getting involved with anything specific, please drop me a line. Again, if we don't have help to make this little "interest area" active then it will just wither away. VAX-13 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Digital Responds to the Fall 1987 SIR Ballot DDiiggiittaall RReessppoonnddss ttoo tthhee FFaallll 11998877 SSIIRR BBaalllloott Mark Oakley SIR Coordinator and Ron Shaefer VMS Engineering At the Anaheim Symposium, Digital responded to the VAX SIG's most recent System Improvement Request ballot. The ballot was originally published in the July, 1987 issue of the Pageswapper and the results can be found in the January, 1988 issue. Below is a summary of the top 10 items followed by Digital's response, as presented by Ron Shaefer. SIR: F87-28 Position: 1 Points: 173 Abstract: Enhance SHOW PROCESS command to display open files and information about subprocesses. Description: Some form of identification is needed for the SHOW PROCESS command to make tracing subprocess trees easier, possibly of the form SHOW PROCESS/SUBPROCESS/ID=. If a user has two processes running in a batch queue or even from two terminals, and each process has a subprocess it is very difficult to determine which subprocess is owned by which parent. The ability to show the files that a specified process has open is needed. SHOW DEVICE/FILES on one drive systems with many installed images provides too much output. If this feature could also show the current location within each file, then estimating what portion of a file had been processed by a program would be significantly easier. Response: There are three parts to this request: 1. Subprocess information: VMS expects to remove the current restriction in a future major release. 2. Open file information: VMS will investigate the implementation of this function in a future major release. VAX-14 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Digital Responds to the Fall 1987 SIR Ballot 3. Current file positioning information: VMS considers it extremely unlikely that VMS will ever implement this function. SIR: F87-24 Position: 2 Points: 146 Abstract: Add the capability to capture an interactive session exactly as it happens. Description: In many cases VMS users need to produce a disk file with the transcript of a terminal session. The need for this is to produce documentation for manuals or turn in as homework for class. The SET HOST/LOG does not completely emulate the terminal output, especially when CR/LF output is suppressed to allow the user to respond to a question on the same line. Also if the SET HOST command has been removed for a user this feature becomes nonexistent. Some command such as SET LOGGING TO is needed to provide this feature. The UNIX script utility would provide a good model for this. Obviously if the captured file contained graphics escape sequences or other non-printable characters it would be the users responsibility to handle them. The ability to record escape sequences into a file might also be a useful debugging tool for some users. Response: This capability is provided by the VAX-11 DEC/Test Manager layered product. At the present time we have no plans to enhance the base capability of VMS. However, based on this SIR, we will evaluate including additional capabilities in this area in the base system. SIR: F87-67 Position: 3 Points: 124 Abstract: Enhance AUTHORIZE to work on a selection or subset of all users according to selection criteria. Subsequent commands should apply to these criteria. Description: It would be useful to construct a subset of all users and have AUTHORIZE operate only on this subset. This feature might look like: UAF> SELECT * /ACCOUNT = PROJECT1 UAF> MODIFY * /SELECTION /WSQUOTA = 1000 VAX-15 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Digital Responds to the Fall 1987 SIR Ballot UAF> LIST * /SELECTION UAF> . UAF> . UAF> . UAF> SELECT * /((ENQLM < 20) .AND. (ACCOUNT = DATABASE)) UAF> MODIFY * /SELECTION /ENQLM = 50 UAF> LIST * /SELECTION Response: As part of the continuing VMS strategy to improve the management tools available for VMS, we intend to address this problem. However, while we expect to provide a solution to this problem, it may not take the form suggested by this SIR. SIR: F87-13 Position: 4 Points: 97 Abstract: All utilities should use a standard format for printable output. Description: Printable output generated by VAX utilities and compilers comes in a great variety of record formats and carriage control conventions. A particularly awkward convention is the use of embedded ASCII control characters to generate multiple print lines from a single record. There appears to be no standard for this or any other mechanism. As a result it is very difficult to print "printable" output on non-DEC printers or transmit it through heterogeneous networks. Digital should document a standard record format and carriage control convention and modify all facilities to conform to this convention. As an alternative, Digital should provide a utility which converts all currently used formats into a standard format. It seems that this functionality currently exists, distributed between the print symbiont, device driver, and "DEC standard" printers. Response: VMS does have a standard set of file formats for printable data. Unfortunately there is more than one format and complete consistency is not present. Achieving better consistency would involve incompatible changes to existing utilities which are not planned. Providing a conversion utility WOULD help although complete consistency is not possible without human intervention. We have no current plans to provide such a partial tool. VAX-16 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Digital Responds to the Fall 1987 SIR Ballot DIGITAL anticipates that future standardized document interfaces and more sophisticated printing capabilities will provide a full solution to this problem in the future. SIR: F87-15 Position: 5 Points: 92 Abstract: Enhance BACKUP to provide first and last file names logged for each volume of storage media and an incremental restore capability for a directory structure. Description: BACKUP should log the first and last file on each volume to assist in choosing tapes for restoration. Directories or entire directory trees sometimes become unusable. To aid in recovery, BACKUP should support the following procedure: 1. Delete the structure(s) affected 2. Restore that structure from the last image mode backup 3. Restore the selected structure(s) in incremental mode. Response: We believe that you are asking BACKUP to be able to perform incremental restoration on entities smaller than volumes; namely directory trees. We agree that this would be useful and we will keep it high on our priority list for the future of BACKUP. SIR: F87-26 Position: 6 Points: 91 Abstract: Enhance VMSMail. Description: VMSMail should be enhanced in the following ways: 1. Allow a user to retract a sent mail message. This could be limited to the last message sent. This would be very useful to retract that nasty undelivered mail message sent to the SYSTEM MANAGER before it is read and you end up with mandatory 32 character one time passwords! VAX-17 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Digital Responds to the Fall 1987 SIR Ballot 2. Provide a facility to append comments to a received mail message and redistribute it. 3. Provide some form of return receipt when the recipient has read your mail message. 4. Provide a facility to allow users to configure the default printer orientation for printed mail messages. Most mail messages are oriented to portrait mode, and not the default landscape mode found on most programmers printers. 5. DEFINE/KEY in mail should support /ERASE in the same way that the DCL DEFINE/KEY does. Response: In general, DIGITAL considers these requests to be beyond the scope of VMSmail. Advanced mail features can be found in mail products which DIGITAL sells. In an upcoming major release of VMS, VMSmail provides a number of enhancements, including: 1. A facility to allow users to configure the default printer queue and form for printed mail messages. 2. A Carbon Copy capability. SIR: F87-11 Position: 7 Points: 89 Abstract: Enhance the ALLOCATE services to allow requests to be queued. Description: Enhance the ALLOCATE services to enable a user to optionally queue the allocation request when all qualifying devices are busy. Device allocation should be handled by a queue manager similar to the VMS V4.0 print queue manager, and the allocation request queues should be made cluster wide to support cluster-visible devices. User functions should include the ability to specify characteristics required of a generic device, the automatic notification of allocation, the ability to delete an allocation request, the ability to examine the allocation request queue, and the ability to do other interactive processing while waiting for an allocation request to be VAX-18 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Digital Responds to the Fall 1987 SIR Ballot granted. Operator functions should include the ability to mark failing devices as unavailable and the ability to force a deallocate. Manager functions should include the ability to define device characteristics and specify physical devices as possessing those characteristics. Device allocation and deallocation should place records in the accounting file so that charge back accounting can be done for allocated devices. A mechanism for avoiding deadlocks when multiple devices are allocated should be provided. Examples: $ ALLOCATE/QUEUED/WAIT TAPE$CLASS:- /CHARACTERISTICS=(DENSITY:6250) LOGICAL_TAPE (Queue an allocation request for a tape drive with 6250 bpi capability and wait until the allocation has completed.) $ ALLOCATE/QUEUED/NOWAIT/NOTIFY DISK$CLASS:- /CHARACTERISTICS=(RA60) MY_DISK_PACK (Queue an allocation request for an RA60 disk drive and return control to my terminal. Notify me when the allocation has completed.) $ ALLOCATE/NOQUEUED TERMINAL$CLASS:- /CHAR=(AUTODIAL,BAUD:1200 DIAL_OUT_MODEM (Allocate a terminal device with a 1200 baud autodial modem but don't queue the request. Give an error if all such devices are allocated.) The queueing capability might be implemented via a symbiont. The queueing capability should also be provided for the MOUNT services. Response: The entire area of resource scheduling and resource queuing is of significant interest for VMS as a production environment computer system. The allocation queuing of devices and allocation of devices based on generalized characteristics are specific components of this basic capability. We hope to address this entire area incrementally in future VAX-19 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Digital Responds to the Fall 1987 SIR Ballot major releases of VMS. SIR: F87-71 Position: 8 Points: 89 Abstract: Provide accounting information about terminal servers. Description: Currently, accounting information does not capture the port number and terminal server name for interactive session that login via LAT's. Port number and terminal server name information is extremely useful for trouble-shooting and determining terminal usage. Response: The recording of LAT port number and terminal server name would provide a useful piece of accounting data and we intend to provide this enhancement in a future release of VAX/VMS. Please recognize, however, that the LAT port number and terminal server name are not necessarily constants for the life of an interactive session, and that our determination of when to record these data may or may not agree with a given site's interpretation of the "correct" data. SIR: F87-2 Position: 9 Points: 83 Abstract: Implement cluster accessible tape drives. Description: Tape drives connected to individual VAXes in a VAXcluster should be usable by all nodes of the cluster. For VAXcluster configurations, the ability to use a tape drive local to another VAX would be very beneficial. Because Local Area VAXclusters cannot have tapes on HSC's, a tape drive has to be configured on every VAXcluster node or the process accessing the tape drive must be on the VAX with the tape drive. Other configurations with only local tape drives would also benefit. Response: Although it is on our wishlist, we have not considered a TMSCP server a high priority item and it will not be in the next major release of VMS. We will re-evaluate the priority of this SIR request for a future major release of VMS. VAX-20 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Digital Responds to the Fall 1987 SIR Ballot SIR: F87-14 Position: 10 Points: 78 Abstract: Provide support for simple project accounting. Description: The Spring 1985 VAX SIR Ballot contained a request for project accounting in VMS. Digital's response was "We also feel that project accounting is very important...We feel that this is a reasonably complex area and, as such, some of the enhancements that we intend to make in this area will appear over time." Project accounting is something that is desperately needed at large sites. In its simplest form, project accounting should provide a SET PROJECT command that would write a process accounting record, and start recording a new record with a new account string specified by the user. The account string should be verified before these actions take place. The system manager should be allowed to set up a file which specifies which UIC's are permitted to use individual account strings. Many sites have immediate government or internal security requirements for "one username per user" level of accountability. DEC should provide this form of project accounting until their full-blown system is available. Response: We concur that project based accounting would be an extremely desirable feature for many of our customers. However, issues of integration with VMS security features make for complications which invalidate the use of the simple model proposed by this SIR. A general solution for this area, that addresses these security issues, allows for compatibility, and provides for the needs of the entire VAX/VMS community, requires fundamental changes to several areas of VAX/VMS. The enhancements that we will provide as part of the base VAX/VMS system that will address this area will appear in future releases of VAX/VMS. SIR: F87-54 Position: 11 Points: 78 VAX-21 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 Digital Responds to the Fall 1987 SIR Ballot Abstract: There should be more Digital developers at DECUS Symposia. Description: With the enormous increase in VAX software provided by Digital over the years, there in an accompanying complexity. The limited number of software developers who are sent to Symposia try valiantly to "cover" for software which is not their own, but it is difficult. Since DECUS symposia are the only way for the user community to engage in a dialog with Digital software developers, there should be a considerable increase in the number of developers who are sent. This could be done by reducing the number of marketers who are not able to provide technical details. The Exhibit Hall could also be reduced to not include "seen-before" hardware. Response: DIGITAL needs assistance in determining what kinds of technical support are needed. Resources do not necessarily increase in proportion to software offerings and complexity. Specifics of uncovered areas would be invaluable in better determining how to apply those resources. DIGITAL is open to new ideas for applying technology to technical support and questions. For example, could better use be made of VAXnotes conferences, VMSmail, tele-conferencing, video-conferencing? Is on-site attendance always required? DIGITAL looks to DECUS for help in developing creative alternatives. VAX-22 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 A Daily Maintenance Procedure A Daily Maintenance Procedure Bob De Wolf Fullerton, CA 92635 Often it is desirable to perform a maintenance function once a day, such as purging a scratch area, monitoring disk space usage, etc. The DAILY.COM procedure listed in Figure 1 can be used to run a DCL procedure on command the first time you login in each day. A daily job can also be run using a batch job that re-submits itself every day, but if every account on a large cluster does this, the queue will become quite cluttered. Also, it is highly desirable to run maintenance procedures at the first login because this is the time when it is most unlikely that something else is running. If you ran a long batch job, for example, it would have to run all night to still be running at the first login of the day. $ !DAILY - Runs a DCL command at first login of the day. $ IF F$MODE() .NES. "INTERACTIVE" THEN EXIT $ DIRECTORY/MODIFIED/SINCE="TODAY" 'P1'/OUTPUT=NL: $ IF $STATUS .NE. %X10018290 THEN EXIT !Once a day only. $ SET PROTECTION 'P1' !Modify it. $ 'P2' 'P3' 'P4' 'P5' 'P6' 'P7' 'P8' $ EXIT Figure 1: DAILY.COM Procedure DAILY.COM uses the modification date of a file to record the time that the maintenance procedure was last run. Before running DAILY, you must create a file in your top level directory to save the modification date. This can be done as follows: $ CREATE DAILY.FILE VAX-23 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 A Daily Maintenance Procedure Next you need to add a line to your LOGIN.COM file to run DAILY.COM. For example: $ @DAILY DAILY.FILE @PURSCR TODAY-3-: The file PURSCR.COM is in the top level directory and will be run at the first login each day. PURSCR is a procedure to delete files from the scratch area. By default VMS assigns the logical name SYS$SCRATCH to the login directory. Commands and programs use SYS$SCRATCH as a path to a directory to create temporary files that are used for a short while and then, if everything goes well, deleted. A problem arises when everything does not go well! If a program or the system crashes, strange unrecognized files may be left in your scratch directory. That's not bad, but things can go even less well. In some cases, errors can occur when scratch files are being deleted that results in non-scratch files being deleted from the scratch directory. Therefore it is highly desirable to create your own scratch directory which will contain only scratch files, and change the assignment of SYS$SCRATCH so that it points to a dedicated scratch directory. The file PURSCR.COM contains a procedure to delete old files from the scratch directory. Figure 2 is contains a listing of PURSCR.COM. $ SINCE_DATE="YESTERDAY-23::" $ IF P1 .NES. "" THEN SINCE_DATE:="''P1'" $ ! $ IF F$PARSE("SYS$SCRATCH:") .EQS. F$PARSE("SYS$LOGIN:") - THEN EXIT $ SAVE_DEF=F$ENVIRONMENT("DEFAULT") $ SET DEFAULT SYS$SCRATCH: $ SET NOON $ DELETE/MODIFIED/BEFORE="''SINCE_DATE'"/LOG/EXCLUDE=*.DIR.*- [...]*.*.* $ IF F$CVTIME(F$TIME(),,"WEEKDAY") .NES. "Friday" - THEN GOTO NOT_FRIDAY $ SET PROTECTION/LOG [...]*.*.* $ DELETE [...]*.DIR.*/LOG $ NOT_FRIDAY: $ SET DEFAULT 'SAVE_DEF' $ EXIT Figure 2: PURSCR.COM Procedure VAX-24 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 A Daily Maintenance Procedure PURSCR deletes files last modified before a relative date specified as the first parameter. This allows files to exist for a specified length of time in the scratch directory. Every Friday PURSCR changes the protection on files in the scratch directory and attempts to delete directory files. Directories containing files will not be removed because VMS will detect this and prevent it. For additional safety, PURSCR verifies that SYS$SCRATCH is not assigned to SYS$LOGIN as this might result unwanted deletions. A scratch directory can also be a place where files are moved to be deleted later. The preliminary moving step is a precaution designed to prevent accidental deletion of files. It allows you to decide to delete a file, but do it at a later time for additional safety. If you decide to use the scratch directory in this way, be sure to SET PROTECTION on the files that you move into the scratch directory. This updates the modification date for the file and insures that the full time delay will pass before they are deleted. Figure 3 contains a listing of the DELETE.COM procedure which is an example of a procedure to implement a 'protected delete' that moves files to a scratch directory where they will actually be deleted after several days. One minor difference between DELETE.COM and the DELETE command is that DELETE.COM will work if the version of the file is not specified, while the DELETE command requires that the version be specified. $ ! DELETE.COM - Protected delete procedure. $ ! This procedure works only for files that $ ! exist on the default device. $ SET PROTECTION 'P1' $ RENAME 'P1' SYS$SCRATCH: Figure 3: DELETE.COM Procedure The following is the complete DCL to add scratch directory maintenance and the customized delete procedure to your LOGIN.COM: $ SET DEFAULT [.SCRATCH] $ ASSIGN 'F$ENVIRONMENT("DEFAULT") SYS$SCRATCH $ SET DEFAULT [-] $ @DAILY DAILY.FILE @PURSCR TODAY-3-: $ DEL=="@DELETE" VAX-25 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 A Daily Maintenance Procedure These commands assume that you have created a SCRATCH subdirectory below your main login directory. The command that runs DAILY specifies that scratch files will have a lifetime of three days. If you type DEL the DELETE.COM procedure will be run. If a longer abbreviation of the DELETE command is used the normal DCL DELETE command will be executed. PURSCR can be replaced with a user tailored procedure to do odds and ends at the start of the day. This might include checking disks to determine if the space is low, generating daily reports, etc. VAX-26 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 VAX/VMS Security VAX/VMS Security Number next in a series By Ray Kaplan PIVOTAL, Inc. P.O. Box 32647 Tucson, Arizona 85751-32647 Viruses, Worms and Trojan Horses - A System Manager's Worst Enemy For two Symposia now, Robert Clyde (Clyde Digital, Provo Utah) and I have given a session with the same name as this article. If it gets scheduled again for the Cincinnati Symposium, we will present part three of our current series of sessions. So far, our two presentations have introduced the threat that these beasts represent to our systems, what makes them tick, and how to protect our systems against them. Since we can't talk in exacting detail about them, we have combined a careful look at exactly what they are (sans examples) and some general system management advice with an definite eye to helping people protect their systems. The problem, of course, is in talking in detail about what they are and exactly how they work using examples. So far, everyone that I see making presentations about these nasty security threats (including us) are not willing to talk in detail about them by presenting examples. The theory is that if detailed examples are presented, "the bad guys" might get hold of them and use them against improperly protected systems. Good argument for being very careful in the presentation of such information, but some how, not completely convincing. I wonder if there is an analogy to AIDS and sex education in here somewhere. With AIDS the idea is that if we talk openly about the mechanisms of sex and how they work (using examples), then we can talk about how to prevent the transmission of AIDS. Yes, I know that there is a logical error in now moving to the conclusion that we can prevent damage by viruses, worms and trojan horses with education. But, I still am ALMOST comfortable with a frank and open discussion of these insidious security problems. VAX-27 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 VAX/VMS Security The only thing that is holding me back is this vivid image I have. See, there is this naive system manager showing me where their system got attacked using one of the "nasty little beasties" that I used in an open discussion of this type of security threat. So, where to from here? Well, how about if we start the process of gathering a collection of war stories and actual samples of these beasts? At the very least, this will allow us to develop the next step in the presentation process that Robert Clyde and I are doing. That is, we can begin to dichotomize them into groups of attack categories and develop specific protection scenarios to recommend. To the end of moving toward the point where we can talk openly about these beasts, this seems like a good first step. If you have a virus, worm, trojan horse or a war story that you'd like to contribute to our efforts - please send it along to me at the above address. As always, your comments are welcome, until next time, Happy VAXing! VAX-28 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT INPUT/OUTPUT A SIG Information Interchange Mail written I/O submissions (no special form required) to: Larry Kilgallen, PAGESWAPPER Editor Box 81, MIT Station Cambridge, MA 02139-0901 USA To register for on-line submission to the Pageswapper dial: (617) 262-6830 (in the United States) using a 1200 baud modem and log in with the username PAGESWAPPER. ================================================================ Note 760.31 VMS 4.6 Installation Experiences 31 of 31 "Harry Herman" 32 lines 7-JAN-1988 22:27 -< Got burnt once with VMSINSTAL OPTION G >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 5 (December, 1987) RE: 760.22 I once restored a backup set using VMSINSTAL's option G that created a backup set on my disk with bad data. The KITINSTAL.COM file was corrupt. I had also used OPTION L (logs BACKUP, DELETE, RENAME, COPY, etc. commands, and noticed that it does not verify when it extracts all the files from the tape's save set into its work directory, but does verify when it creates the new backup set in the destination directory from all the files in the work directory. After calling the appropriate development group and saying I had a bad tape (it was a field test), I tried using COPY to copy the save sets off of the TK50 instead of using VMSINSTAL's OPTION G. This time the kit installed w/o a problem. So I called the team back and said false alarm. VAX-29 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Since then I have always used COPY instead of BACKUP, and have yet to have a corrupt backup set. I originally used VMSINSTAL's OPTION G to rebuild a new save set on disk because I was used to RSTS BACKUP which writes file attributes for the backup save set differently depending on whether the output medium is tape or disk, and you could not just copy a RSTS BACKUP set off of tape to disk and access it on disk. I was afraid VMS BACKUP might do something similar, so I used VMSINSTAL to re-create the backup set. However, after COPYing backup sets off of tape and using them to restore files, etc., I know now that tape backup sets can be used when copied to disk, so I do not waste my time with VMSINSTAL OPTION G. Harry Herman Corpane Industries 10100 Bluegrass Parkway Louisville, KY 40299 (502) 491-4433 ================================================================ Note 784.29 In search of a modem 29 of 31 "Tim Sagstetter" 16 lines 5-JAN-1988 18:58 -< To Brian >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 5 (December, 1987) through Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 6 (January, 1988) I would like to cast my vote the MicroCom AX/9624c, also. Although we too got 5 bad modems before getting a good one, a little research showed all the bad modems to have been manufactured almost a year ago. A call to the factory confirmed that MicroCom had some problems a while back. Two factory fresh modems worked on the first try and are still in service. I certainly have had my share of the frustration everyone has mentioned, but once a new modem learned, it is pretty much a plug-and-go proposition. We are also using our AX/9624c's with DECnet. However, since flow control must be disabled, if the line throughput drops below that of the async port due to fallback on a noisy line, our DECnet circuit goes down. We tried RTS/CTS flow control, but DECnet doesn't like it. Brian, are you seeing this too or VAX-30 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT are we doing something wrong? Tim Sagstetter WAUSAU group 2801 North 7th Street Wausau, WI 54402-1746 (715) 847-6784 ================================================================ Note 784.31 In search of a modem 31 of 31 "Brian Tillman, Smiths Industries." 16 lines 6-JAN-1988 15:32 -< No fallback so far. >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 5 (December, 1987) through Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 6 (January, 1988) RE: < Note 784.29 by NODE::US108735 "Tim Sagstetter" > -< To Brian >- | We tried RTS/CTS flow control, but DECnet doesn't like it. | Brian, are you seeing this too or are we doing something wrong? We also had to disable RTS/CTS and found DECnet wouldn't work at all with ANY kind of flow control. We have not yet had a problem with the modems falling back to a lower speed due to noisy lines (just lucky I guess). We have one connection to Pope AIR FORCE BASE in North Carolina that runs consistently well at 9600 bps (although the effective speed is significantly less. I don't know why). We have another link to New Zealand that we've only been able to get working at 1200 bps so far. Before dedicating these AX modems to DECnet, we used them as dial outs and were VERY pleased. Brian Tillman Lear Siegler, Inc. 4141 Eastern Ave. MS121 Grand Rapids, MI 49518-8727 (616)241-8425 VAX-31 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 799.4 Anyone with RAF experience? 4 of 13 "Tim Sagstetter" 9 lines 5-JAN-1988 19:14 -< RAF Experience >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- We have been using RAF for about a year now. The current version is still copy protected and seems to have a correct emulation of a VT220. The functionality we have used has been excellent. We move Lotus 1-2-3 binary files to VAX and back pretty successfully. That is, using an async connection through a terminal server works up to files sizes of about 130,000 bytes. Datability says they have some problem supporting the server. We have not used the product over an Ethernet connection. Tim Sagstetter WAUSAU group 2801 North 7th Street Wausau, WI 54402-1746 (715) 847-6784 ================================================================ Note 799.5 Anyone with RAF experience? 5 of 13 "M. Erik Husby" 69 lines 18-JAN-1988 13:49 -< A short report on RAF >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- A short report on my experiences with RAF. We ordered the trial copy and installed it on a PC and my VAXmate. It worked correctly on both machines. However, on the VAXmate it would not use the keyboard in VT220 mode, only in IBM PC mode which makes the terminal emulation difficult to use. I use a VAXmate because I did not want to learn another keyboard -- I also have a VT220 on my desk. Individual file transfers seemed to be faster than the Digital PCFS. However, directory lookups were significantly slower. I ran a compilation and link using the Microsoft MAKE utility and it took twice as long using RAF as it did using PCFS. VAX-32 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT RAF attempts to dynamically determine if the file being transferred from the PC to the VAX is text or binary. If the file is text, it writes it as a STREAM mode file otherwise it writes it as FIXED 512 BYTES. The test for text versus binary is: File is binary if it contains any character whose value is larger than 127. For us that means any source code that contains a graphic drawing character. There is no way in RAF to force text mode. I did not have this kind of problem with PCFS as it writes all files as STREAM LF files. Because of the way RAF and PCFS differ over file formats prevents them from sharing anything except source files. Object files produced by Microsoft C using PCFS are not readable by the Microsoft Linker using RAF. On our PC's we use a program called EASYPATH to give the VMS equivalents of search lists. When RAF was used, the EASYPATH search lists were used. However, one could not run the EASYPATH controlling program when a RAF virtual disk was the current disk. Sometimes it is necessary to turn the search lists on and off. Positive aspects of RAF. Each PC gets its own file server. With PCFS, there is one server for all PC's. Because each PC is logged on as a VMS user with a terminal, RAF can intercept broadcast messages and display them on the PC even if the PC is NOT in terminal emulation mode. Because each PC is logged on as a VMS user, RAF can define a PC program that calls up a VMS program. Thus it is possible to define a PC program which drops into VMS MAIL. The PC user does not need to see a VMS $ to execute VMS programs. In spite of the good parts, I am still looking for a networking product. RAF does not seem to be fast enough for our purposes. VAX-33 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Note: One reason we are not looking at PCFS is that it only runs on true IBM PC's. As we have numerous clones, we would have to buy new cpu's to use PCFS. M. Erik Husby Project Software & Development 14 Story St. Cambridge, MA. 02138 (617)-661-1666 ================================================================ Note 799.6 Anyone with RAF experience? 6 of 13 "Dale E. Coy (505) 667-3270" 8 lines 18-JAN-1988 19:33 -< Comparative trials are very helpful >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- I'm glad to see you analysis, based on comparative trial. That's a real help. I presume that you have actually tried PCFS with your "clones", rather than just assuming it won't work. We have tried it with several clones, and it worked with all except the AT&Ts. It might be helpful to others if you would contribute your list of "what clones do and don't work with PCFS". DALE E. COY LOS ALAMOS NATIONAL LAB PO BOX 1663, MS J957 LOS ALAMOS, NM 87545 505-667-3270 ================================================================ Note 799.8 Anyone with RAF experience? 8 of 13 "Brian Tillman, Smiths Industries." 8 lines 19-JAN-1988 12:06 -< Are you sure? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- RE: < Note 799.5 by NODE::US110737 "M. Erik Husby" > -< A short report on RAF >- | Note: One reason we are not looking at PCFS is that it only | runs on true IBM PC's. As we have numerous clones, we would | have to buy new cpu's to use PCFS. VAX-34 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT We run PCFS on Compaq 386s. Brian Tillman Lear Siegler, Inc. 4141 Eastern Ave. MS121 Grand Rapids, MI 49518-8727 (616)241-8425 ================================================================ Note 799.9 Anyone with RAF experience? 9 of 13 "John Osudar" 6 lines 20-JAN-1988 15:26 -< PCFS works on clones >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- And we run PCFS on AST 286's. I think the impression that it works only on real PC's comes from the fact that you have to install PCFS from some strange combination of hardware and PC-DOS version. (I didn't do the installation here, so I don't recall specific details...) It certainly DOES work with (at least some) clones. John Osudar Argonne National Laboratory 9700 S. Cass Ave. Bldg. 205 A-051 Argonne, IL 60439-4837 (312) 972-7505 ================================================================ Note 799.10 Anyone with RAF experience? 10 of 13 "M. Erik Husby" 42 lines 26-JAN-1988 12:25 -< PCFS, RAF, and clones >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- I tried DECnet-DOS on a PC LIMITED 286 with a 3COM board and it failed. Contacting Digital telephone support returned the answer that "We only support real IBM PC's". Have not tried putting a DEPCA in the PC LIMITED 286 so can not say if it would work. We have not done extensive analysis, but running one of our applications with PCFS on an IBM PC was slower than on a VAXmate. VAX-35 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Crude performance results: Transferring a 550 block file. VAXmate PCFS From VAX to PC memory drive 12 seconds. VAXmate RAF From VAX to PC memory drive 7 seconds. We will most likely go with RAF because: Throughput is faster. Works with Clones and 3COM boards (existing hardware). Currently runs on PS/2 machines in DOS mode (3com and Ungerman Bass boards). Will almost assuredly run under OS/2 -- Datability has the OS/2 developers kits but is not saying when. Can do some nice things with it such as defining a PC command that invokes a VAX program without needing to know control has transferred to the VAX. Not using PCFS because: Would have to replace all 3COM boards with depca's. Turns out to be more expensive even with our discount. Throughput is not sufficient. M. Erik Husby Project Software & Development 14 Story St. Cambridge, MA. 02138 (617)-661-1666 VAX-36 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 799.11 Anyone with RAF experience? 11 of 13 "Bill Mayhew" 12 lines 26-JAN-1988 22:46 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Bear in mind that Digital has made an unusual public announcement of what's expected to be in V2 of PCSA, and it addresses almost all of your concerns: supporting non-DEC Ethernet boards (3Com and Micom-Interlan, I believe), much improved performance, a promise of future OS/2 support. My reading is that DEC is very serious about this product, much as the first release might lead you to think otherwise. However, all things that are not yet real products are of course subject to change, though DEC has at least put this info about V2 in "writing". DEC has not put forth any info yet about dates and prices. There are some other claims and promises made, but I don't recall them off hand. Bill Mayhew Village Systems Workshop Inc PO Box 642 Natick MA 01760 617-237-0238 ================================================================ Note 804.0 Using TDMS & CMS 3 replies "Ken Robinson" 14 lines 29-OCT-1987 16:36 ---------------------------------------------------------------- We use CMS to store sources for the product we are producing here. We are having a problem keeping track of TDMS forms using CMS. It seems once a TDMS form is created in the CDD, there is no way extracting the form from CDD in a format that can be stored in CMS and then used to recreate the form automatically. If anyone has any suggestions, they will be much appreciated. Ken Robinson Bell Communications Research 444 Hoes Lane, Room 4d449 Piscataway,N.J. 08854 (201)699-8796 VAX-37 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 804.1 Using TDMS & CMS 1 of 3 "Mark N. Katz" 12 lines 5-JAN-1988 09:59 -< Some thoughts on storing forms in CMS >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- No real help but I did stress the need for some sort of forms definition language to a DEC TDMS person at Anaheim. All you can do currently is do an FDU LIST and store the listing for reference. You can't recreate the form from the listing but you can tel if the form you recreated by hand matches the one whose listing is controlled in CMS. The new binary file capability in CMS v3.0 won't really help much since the stuff is in CDD, not a file. But.. maybe using DMU backup and restore along with binary files in CMS, you might be able to work out a scheme. Mark N. Katz GTE Government Systems 100 First Ave. MS:1240 Waltham MA 02154 ================================================================ Note 804.2 Using TDMS & CMS 2 of 3 "Bob Hassinger" 0 lines 5-JAN-1988 10:55 -< It sounds like FMS wins again on this one... >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Hassinger Liberty Mutual Research Center 71 Frankland Road Hopkinton, MA 01748 617-435-9061 VAX-38 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 804.3 Using TDMS & CMS 3 of 3 "Ken Robinson" 7 lines 6-JAN-1988 11:40 -< FMS definitely wins! :-) >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Actually the DMU backup file format is compatible with CMS 2.3. We have thought of using that, but the limitations on DMU Restore are causing problems. For example, DMU restore will NOT restore if what you are restoring is already there (it won't even create a new version!) Ken Robinson Bell Communications Research 444 Hoes Lane, Room 4d449 Piscataway,N.J. 08854 (201)699-8796 ================================================================ Note 806.29 Memory help, please. 29 of 30 "John Osudar" 36 lines 20-JAN-1988 15:11 -< SMBSRVSHR patch for $PURGWS >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | I heard someone at the Anaheim DECUS say that the page activity | of the print symbiont can be much improved by patching out the | three places where it does a $PURGWS - to prevent it from | bularemically binging and purging on memory. Haven't had time | to try it yet, but it sounds reasonable enough. Yes, I was the one who brought that up in Anaheim. I patched SMBSRVSHR to eliminate those $PURGWS references. There are three places in the code (address dependent upon version of VMS, of course -- in V4.4 the addresses were 000047F8, 00004A63, and 00007342) where SMBSRVSHR does a PUSHAB of an argument followed by a CALLS #1,@#7FFEDFB0 (which was the P1 entry to $PURGWS). Using PATCH, you can replace these two instructions with a NOP. The effect of this patch is to prevent the frequent working set purging done by the symbiont code. This will cause your dormant symbiont processes to retain fairly large working sets (e.g. on our system they are typically in the 600 to 700 page range) but will prevent the fluctuations seen otherwise. (Of course, you can control working set size through queue parameters and system defaults, so you can tailor VAX-39 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT the dormant size to your system's needs.) I took a brief look at the possibility of leaving one or two of the $PURGWS calls, and targeting the one(s) that cause the most trouble; it didn't seem worthwhile to me, and the code was complex enough that I didn't want to waste time figuring it out. One other thing you can do, assuming your printers aren't extremely busy, is to patch PRTSMB.EXE to increase the number of streams (i.e. queues) it can handle. (This, of course, only applies to queues handled by the default symbiont.) The longword at 00000200 in PRTSMB is the number of streams; replace the default value of 16 (00000010) with any number up to 32 (00000020). (You can also reduce this number if you like, e.g. if you have some particularly busy printers and the symbiont isn't keeping up.) Doing this can reduce the number of symbiont processes on your system, and in combination with the $PURGWS patch, it can reduce the amount of paging (and number of pages) required to support your symbionts. John Osudar Argonne National Laboratory 9700 S. Cass Ave. Bldg. 205 A-051 Argonne, IL 60439-4837 (312) 972-7505 ================================================================ Note 830.4 Looking for TeX Driver 4 of 6 "Bill Hoelzer" 8 lines 11-JAN-1988 16:43 -< HP LaserJet+ >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- We are looking for a driver for an HP LaserJet+. Any information would be appreciated. Bill Hoelzer Quorum Systems 5165 Campus Drive Plymouth Meeting, PA 19462 VAX-40 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 830.5 Looking for TeX Driver 5 of 6 "Lynn D. Crockett" 12 lines 27-JAN-1988 02:18 -< TeX Driver for Terminals??? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- I am looking for TeX driver to view .DVI files on any DEC Graphics Terminals. We have developed a primitive one but were curious if better ones are available. Lynn D. Crockett Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology 5500 Wabash Avenue Box 1367 Terre Haute, IN 47803-3999 (812) 877-1511 Ext 239 ================================================================ Note 830.6 Looking for TeX Driver 6 of 6 "Kevin Angley" 12 lines 27-JAN-1988 11:52 -< LN01 drivers >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- The 1988 Spring Symposium Proceedings Information packet lists the following information: LN01 driver for VMS: Louisiana State Univ Neil Stoltzfus 504-388-1570 LN01 driver for UNIX: Univ.of Washington Pierre MacKay 206-543-2386 There are no listings for HP or graphics terminals. Kevin Angley 3301 Terminal Drive Raleigh, NC 27604 (919) 890-1416 VAX-41 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 833.17 LAT problems 17 of 19 "Bob Hassinger" 7 lines 15-JAN-1988 09:53 -< Reported status of DS200 V2.0 release... >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 7 (February, 1988) On October 21 CSC Network Services (Colorado telephone support) told me the V2.0 release for the DECserver 200 would be out in "a couple of months". When I followed up this week they told me "a month". I don't like this rate of progress very well but I do think the release is not too far off now. Bob Hassinger Liberty Mutual Research Center 71 Frankland Road Hopkinton, MA 01748 617-435-9061 ================================================================ Note 855.2 Hook into VMSMAIL send function 2 of 3 "Mark Schell (919) 773-7040" 5 lines 1-JAN-1988 15:08 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 7 (February, 1988) I'd be careful about implementing anything like this in the near future. I wouldn't be surprised if many of the "undocumented" features disappear in "an upcoming major release" of VMS. Mark Schell DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORPORATION 8025 NORTH POINT BLVD SUITE 100 WEST WINSTON SALEM NC 27106 VAX-42 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 855.3 Hook into VMSMAIL send function 3 of 3 "John Osudar" 13 lines 12-JAN-1988 20:41 -< yes >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 7 (February, 1988) | I'd be careful about implementing anything like this in the near | future. I wouldn't be surprised if many of the "undocumented" | features disappear in "an upcoming major release" of VMS. Right. DEC has stated (officially or unofficially) that VMS V5 MAIL will have a supported, documented callable interface that will take the place of the unsupported, undocumented foreign protocol interface. However, I suspect that the job of writing a foreign protocol mail program for VMS V4 will be very similar to the job of writing the same program to use callable mail in V5, so it may be worth doing (conversion might be fairly straightforward -- but no guarantees!) And, of course, there's no telling when the first stable point release of V5 (V5.2?!) will appear! ;-) John Osudar Argonne National Laboratory 9700 S. Cass Ave. Bldg. 205 A-051 Argonne, IL 60439-4837 (312) 972-7505 ================================================================ Note 857.5 Printing Bar Codes on an LA100 5 of 5 "Tim Sagstetter" 7 lines 5-JAN-1988 18:06 -< CIE Terminals Font Cartridge >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Thank you all for your help. I will pursue the leads you have offered. However, as luck would have it, the LA210 compatible printers we are using are CIE Terminal's CI-3500 and CI-4000's and CIET has just introduced a bar code font cartridge for them. In midstream, just switch fonts, send attributes and data, switch back to LA210 and continue. Currently, the cartridge only supports LA210 (LA100, LA120) and code 39, but the cost is only $160. VAX-43 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Tim Sagstetter WAUSAU group 2801 North 7th Street Wausau, WI 54402-1746 (715) 847-6784 ================================================================ Note 858.11 Just got SPEARed 11 of 17 "Rytis T. Balciunas" 10 lines 4-JAN-1988 08:55 -< more on SPEAR and VAXsim >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 7 (February, 1988) SPEAR, in its various forms, has been around on my systems for a little over a year -while Field Circus says it is useful, I have removed it because the user's copies have none of the "expert system" error analysis, whereas Colorado does have it. VAXsim is ok to have around, though with VMS 4.6, all it does is give pretty pictures and cryptic error codes. I stick with ANALYZE/ERROR, which gives me the most info. Our Field Service is about as useful as gasoline on a burning building...so I look upon their "gifts" with a very cynical eye... RYTIS T. BALCIUNAS CALGON CARBON CORPORATION PO BOX 717 PITTSBURGH PA 15230-0717 (412)787-6784 ================================================================ Note 858.12 Just got SPEARed 12 of 17 "Seton Droppers, PBS, (703)739-5100" 19 lines 7-JAN-1988 12:09 -< Other VAXsim like products soon??? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 7 (February, 1988) SPEAR: VAX-44 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Never worked, never used it. SPEAR seemed to be harder to use than ANALYZE/ERROR. VAXsim: This "product" appears to be a way for you to do more of your own error monitoring with less hassle. We had it for a bit, but I must admit I never used it that much, it was just an easier way to look at error history for a particular device. When we moved to third party maintenance, Field Service removed both SPEAR and VAXsim. Our new maintenance vendor seems to the same thing as VAXsim, but by hand -- they log in every day or two and check out the error logs (more than DEC EVER did...). I spoke with our new maintenance vendor about VAXsim and they said to wait a bit (maybe this spring was the indication) and some third party software should be available that makes VAXsim look old and archaic. Seton R. Droppers Public Broadcasting Service 1320 Braddock Place Alexandria, VA 22314 (703)739-5100 ================================================================ Note 858.13 Just got SPEARed 13 of 17 "Kevin Angley" 8 lines 7-JAN-1988 16:29 -< In defense of VAXsim >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 7 (February, 1988) As I said previously, I like VAXsim. Not only does it give me recent errors at a glance (for all nodes in the cluster and the network!), but it automatically sends me mail at predetermined thresholds. You still need ANALYZE/ERROR eventually, but automatic notification is nice. By the way, our DEC field engineer does call in periodically to check for errors. Kevin Angley 3301 Terminal Drive Raleigh, NC 27604 VAX-45 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT (919) 890-1416 ================================================================ Note 858.14 Just got SPEARed 14 of 17 "Rytis T. Balciunas" 8 lines 16-JAN-1988 09:08 -< Offensive field service.. >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 7 (February, 1988) From what I've seen in this note, some of you folks have the "cream of the crop" for field service - is this what the DECSERVICE level is supposed to be about??? Hell, I'm lucky that the Pittsburgh field service CALLS me to see how things are going, let alone come in and check error logs! I even have to call THEM to remind them of the quarterly PM! Hmmm....maybe "Field Service - what you pay for and what you get" should be a whole new topic!??! RYTIS T. BALCIUNAS CALGON CARBON CORPORATION PO BOX 717 PITTSBURGH PA 15230-0717 (412)787-6784 ================================================================ Note 858.15 Just got SPEARed 15 of 17 "Kevin Angley" 16 lines 24-JAN-1988 23:01 -< A negative for VAXsim >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 7 (February, 1988) My previous comments about VAXsim have been mostly positive, so let me throw in a negative. We have third party tape controllers/drives that report soft errors for a lot of really soft reasons ... anyway, the default thresholds for automatic notification of severe problems with the "TS11" is set way too low in VAXsim. So I, or rather the trusty DEC field engineer, types "VAXSIM MODIFY THRESHOLD" or some such, and it says, "Password?". No, it's not looking for the FIELD password. No, we did not set a password for VAXsim when we installed it. No, its not in the documentation. VAX-46 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Best part .. "they" won't even tell the DEC guy what it is .. says he has no business changing the thresholds .. Gosh, I remember when it was our system. Kevin Angley 3301 Terminal Drive Raleigh, NC 27604 (919) 890-1416 ================================================================ Note 858.16 Just got SPEARed 16 of 17 "Terry Kennedy" 17 lines 25-JAN-1988 02:04 -< DEC not honoring VAXsim licenses >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 7 (February, 1988) | Best part .. "they" won't even tell the DEC guy what it is .. | says he has no business changing the thresholds .. Yep - sounds like the "new DEC" to me. We just went 3rd-party service, accelerated by our DECrep erasing the RA81 (not just the data, either - he blew the format, too...) on one of our other systems. Now for the interesting part - We bought a VAXsim license when it first came out (I think the part # is Q%060). DEC REFUSES to honor or even acknowledge that we have this license, and is demanding back the VAXsim tapes we paid for! Well, anyway, our new Sorbus service representative says that they will have something by this fall "that blows VAXsim out of the water". We shall see... Terry Kennedy 95 Mohawk Trail Ringwood, N.J. 07456 (201) 435-1890 VAX-47 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 858.17 Just got SPEARed 17 of 17 "Stuart Renes" 8 lines 25-JAN-1988 15:20 -< You think *YOU got SPEARED? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Antecedent IO(s) published in: Pageswapper Volume 9 Number 7 (February, 1988) Speaking of Field Service (we were, weren't we?), I just got Rev. 30 of the VAXPAX diagnostics on my 8530. Guess DEC is serious about unlicensed sites getting their software as Rev. 30 Diagnostic Supervisor wouldn't even run... (my field engineer had no knowledge of this apparent change)... still no resolution! ....hmmmm... shades of VMS 5.0 which *MAY* have layered software licensing protection! Stuart Renes AT&T Technologies, Inc. Mail Stop: 2793 3000 Skyline Dr. Mesquite, TX 75149 (214) 288-2286 ================================================================ Note 859.7 Has anybody used the SIDRIVER 7 of 11 "gerson cohen" 5 lines 14-JAN-1988 13:52 -< Don't believe all that you read! >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- I just talked with software support in CO about the SIDRIVER and the sample program in the driver manual. Don't expect the program to work. It is a known and they are waiting for the development team to respond. They have no comments at this time about the integrity of the driver. gerson cohen nih bldg 2 rm 312 bethesda md 20205 301-496-4295 VAX-48 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 859.8 Has anybody used the SIDRIVER 8 of 11 "Jonathan M. Prigot" 13 lines 14-JAN-1988 15:58 ---------------------------------------------------------------- This may or may not have some bearing on the subject at hand. DEC has just announced a new 2000 lpm printer (LP29). In the announcement are the following two paragraphs. "A new revision of the DMB32 VAXBI communications controller, (sic) is required to support the LP29 on Digital VAX systems", and "The DMB32 has been enhanced to support 2000 lpm. It is important to note that all orders for new DMB32s must request Revision J". Jonathan M. Prigot W.R. Grace & Company 55 Hayden Avenue Lexington, MA 02173 617-861-6600 x2148 ================================================================ Note 859.11 Has anybody used the SIDRIVER 11 of 11 "GREG P. SCHULZ" 10 lines 24-JAN-1988 11:38 -< IT WORKS (KIND OF!!!) >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- We have the SIDRIVER installed on a couple of our systems. We have it on a 8530 and 8200. The 8200 copy is working (DO NOT TRY UTEP..) as we are using VMS/SNA to communicate with our SNA network. An interesting note is that in order for VMS/SNA to work, DEC supplies a new version of SIDRIVER with the distribution for VMS/SNA. Does DEC known something??? GREG P. SCHULZ BURLINGTON NORTHERN RR ISS LOC 3 176 E 5TH STT ST. PAUL, MN 55164 612 298-7344 VAX-49 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 863.0 SET HOST: RSX <--> VMS 5 replies "Bill Mayhew" 53 lines 31-DEC-1987 00:17 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Anybody out there using, or attempting to use, DECnet/VMS and DECnet/RSX together with each other, in particular doing SET HOSTs from one system to the other? I seem to be having a whole bunch of problems... Configuration: 11/73 running MicroRSX 3.1 (virtually M-Plus) and MicroRSX DECnet V1.0 (a new release has just, or is about to, make it to the SDC, I understand), and a MicroVAX 2000 running VMS 4.5 and DECnet 4.5 (4.4? Well, the latest one, not counting 4.6). A static asynchronous line is used to connect the two systems, since the 11/73 has no Ethernet hardware (yet, but will never if this is the best behavior I can expect...). Symptoms include: SET HOST from RSX to VMS: a. Drops linefeeds in some situations, e.g. user-written VAX C code that reads from standard input -- use hits Return, gets a CR but no LF, so multiple interaction-prompts overwrite each other on the screen. b. Loses support for VMS DCL line-editing: uparrow, leftarrow, etc. to DCL are all treated like uparrow; ^H is placed in the command line as a data character; ^E does nothing I could determine (may also be being treated as data). This latter one may be related to the fact that you can't do a SET TERM /ESCAPE on a VMS RTAn: line, though /LINE_EDIT and /INSERT are both set. c. REALLY weird things happen if you try to use VMS Kermit or SET HOST/DTE to call another system via another serial port through the MicroVAX: anything that generates significant output to you "hangs" after about 40 or 50 characters, and requires that you type some other character on your keyboard to get it to complete. There is one communications program, though, HOST32 (developed for use with CompuServe but usable for VAX-50 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT general purposes), which works fine, and which is known to do totally single-byte I/O. SET HOST from VMS to RSX: a. Can't set /TYPEAHEAD on RSX's RTn: line. Attempting to do typeahead gets your terminal hung in interesting ways unless you're set to /FULL_DUPLEX (^C echoes two $ prompts, nothing else echoes anything or does anything); /FULL_DUPLEX still "loses" the typeahead data, and won't echo any normal commands you type from then forward, until you do a ^C at which point things are back to normal. b. Some RSX programs which normally handle escape sequences from an LK201 keyboard break and die when the input is coming from an RT: instead of a TT:, though this appears to be simply an unfortunate implementation decision by the application developers since I think a restriction along these lines, based on one specific QIO variant, is noted in the RSX documentation. (Yes, of course, they're DEC applications!) These problems appear to me to be so serious and so fundamental that it's hard to believe they're real. Comments? Bill Mayhew Village Systems Workshop Inc PO Box 642 Natick MA 01760 617-237-0238 VAX-51 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 863.1 SET HOST: RSX <--> VMS 1 of 5 "Dale E. Coy (505) 667-3270" 15 lines 31-DEC-1987 18:57 -< A confirmation >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- I haven't done all the testing you have, but I've seen the following: SET HOST from RSX to VMS. Then, using VAXNet to dial out from the VAX, the "echo" is precisely one character behind what is "typed". Tried using Set Host/DTE, and the "echo" was 3 characters behind (I think - a little hard to tell). In 5 separate sessions at DECUS, I tried to get an answer to the problem. Nobody would postulate whether it is in RSX, DECNet RSX, DECNet VMS, VMS, or.... At least there wasn't a lot of finger pointing. All the advice was along the lines of "SPR Everything". There is obviously a problem somewhere. I, too, would like to solicit any ideas (even for further diagnostics). DALE E. COY LOS ALAMOS NATIONAL LAB PO BOX 1663, MS J957 LOS ALAMOS, NM 87545 505-667-3270 ================================================================ Note 863.3 SET HOST: RSX <--> VMS 3 of 5 "Joe Sewell" 16 lines 4-JAN-1988 12:08 -< Yes, it IS a mess >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- I used to work on a similar setup ... terminal tied to an 11/73 running RSX-11M+ 2.1E or something (we never upgraded to 3.0) going via Ethernet to a 11/750 running VMS 4.1. I, too, experienced many of the same problems. The best I could come up with was that there was something inherently incompatible with RMTACP and the RT: driver on the PDP side and DECnet-VAX and the RT driver on the VAX side. VAX-52 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT I did, however, find a solution to Dale's problem, which was also happening to us. It works better if the terminal on the PDP side is set to full duplex. In our case we had the full duplex driver installed, but every terminal was still /HDX. Doing a SET /HDX=TI: (I always preferred MCR) took care of the echo problems. What was happening was that the echo operation (the QIO write operation) was being held back on the PDP side by an outstanding read. Joe Sewell Level Five Research 503 Fifth Avenue Indialantic, FL 32903 (305)729-9046 ================================================================ Note 863.4 SET HOST: RSX <--> VMS 4 of 5 "Bill Mayhew" 6 lines 4-JAN-1988 22:38 -< One down? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks very much for pointing out that obvious problem. Of course I had checked to make sure my RTn: port was set to /FULL, but I forgot all about the outgoing TTn: port to the modem!! I'll have to try that... {red-faced grin} Of course that only solves one of the problems... Bill Mayhew Village Systems Workshop Inc PO Box 642 Natick MA 01760 617-237-0238 VAX-53 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 863.5 SET HOST: RSX <--> VMS 5 of 5 "Harry Herman" 63 lines 12-JAN-1988 23:15 -< Comments on RSX <--> VMS from occasional user >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Re: .0 I use SET HOST fairly frequently to go from RSX to VMS and occasionally to go from VMS to RSX. We have an 11/73 running RSX-11M+ V4.0 and M+ DECNET V4.0. We also used DECNET V3.0 and have not seen any changes between DECNET 3.0 and DECNET 4.0 talking to a MicroVAX II running MicroVMS V4.5. In response to your comments: RSX to VMS a) I have never noticed any problems with prompts overwriting each other, but never used C, so do not know if it is unique to C or not. b) Line editing on VMS uses a non-standard CTERM protocol that is unique to VMS. Apparently it has not been made part of the CTERM standard, so I do not know if any other operating system will implement it. Apparently if going VMS to VMS, typing the up-arrow goes across as a normal CTERM packet, but then both VAXes switch to a private protocol to handle the left/right arrows, ^E, ^H, etc. RSX does not know the protocol so sends the left/right arrows, ^E, ^H, etc. as normal characters, which VMS rejects for line editing c) I have never had problems with output hanging until a character is typed, although that does sound similar to something I have seen using LAT lines from a terminal server or a VAXmate. Seems that the line hangs periodically, but will clear after 5-20 seconds, but on occasion has hung longer and then cleared after a character or two is typed. VMS to RSX: VAX-54 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT a) I have never changed the RT: /TYPEAHEAD from its default of /NOTYPEAHEAD, as a matter of fact, I did not know the default was /NOTYPEAHEAD until I read your note! I therefore have not seen the double ^C problem you mentioned, although I have seen it written up on either the RSX QAR system or the DECNET QAR system, so maybe it will be fixed some day. {grin} b) I have never had problems with screen editing over RT: lines, but do not use any other applications that do escape sequence input over RT: lines. One thing I have seen doing either VMS to RSX or RSX to RSX (I can't remember which), is that ^Z does not get properly passed over the link. For example, I have tried to run ACNT over an RT: line, but it does not recognize ^Z, and since the only way out of ACNT is to type ^Z, I end up having to type: ^C ABO ACNT (I too prefer MCR), and then unlock the account file. Harry Herman Corpane Industries 10100 Bluegrass Parkway Louisville, KY 40299 (502) 491-4433 ================================================================ Note 864.0 Security Blanket 3 replies "G. Del Merritt" 13 lines 4-JAN-1988 17:23 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Why do some of the security tools require more than just the SECURITY privilege to work? I am thinking in particular about SHOW INTRUSION, and that it requires CMKRNL to do it's job. I got the impression that the security manager did not *have* to be the system manager, but it looks like that person indeed must be at least as technically trustworthy as s/he is "need-to-know" trustworthy. VAX-55 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Wouldn't it make more sense for the SECURITY privilege to be enough for all security oriented tools? That way the responsibility for security management could be delegated without much worry about the accidents that can happen through unintentional overuse of privilege. Is this something that is to be/has been addressed in the new system management architecture? G. Del Merritt 55 Walkers Brook Drive Reading, MA 01867 ================================================================ Note 864.1 Security Blanket 1 of 3 "John Osudar" 7 lines 12-JAN-1988 20:47 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Just guessing -- but it may be hard to get around requiring CMKRNL if a particular piece of software has to access kernel mode code/data. If something requires other than CMKRNL (or CMEXEC) privilege, then I would question it. But needing CMKRNL would seem to make sense. (If you really want the security manager to not have CMKRNL, you have to install the image with privilege. Not sure if that's a good idea or a bad one...) John Osudar Argonne National Laboratory 9700 S. Cass Ave. Bldg. 205 A-051 Argonne, IL 60439-4837 (312) 972-7505 ================================================================ Note 864.2 Security Blanket 2 of 3 "Larry Kilgallen" 8 lines 12-JAN-1988 21:36 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Installing an image with CMKRNL only really produces the desired effect if DEC has taken that into account in their coding -- by retracting CMKRNL unless SECURITY is held by the user. That is what I see as the nature of the request, to be able to grant a logical privilege and have it do what it needs to do with CMKRNL only in pursuit of valid security goals. Sounds like an excellent SIR for next time if made more general. Submit it now, Cincinnati is too late! VAX-56 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Larry Kilgallen Box 81, MIT Station Cambridge, MA 02139-0901 ================================================================ Note 864.3 Security Blanket 3 of 3 "John Osudar" 3 lines 13-JAN-1988 15:31 ---------------------------------------------------------------- I agree; I wasn't arguing with the intent of the original question, just speculating about the (presumably technical) reasons for things being as they are. John Osudar Argonne National Laboratory 9700 S. Cass Ave. Bldg. 205 A-051 Argonne, IL 60439-4837 (312) 972-7505 ================================================================ Note 865.0 terminal server delay on dial up? 5 replies "DAVID JENSEN" 14 lines 4-JAN-1988 20:09 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Does anyone else experience a 3 second delay before you can autobaud a terminal server through a dialup. Since speed and alternate speed do not work, you must leave autobaud enabled on the terminal server (which does work), but before you can press carriage return you must wait approximately 3 seconds or any input before then is ignored, not received. Or is there something that I may/may not be doing correctly??? DAVID JENSEN COORS PACKAGING COMPANY PO BOX 1501 GOLDEN, CO 80401 VAX-57 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 865.1 terminal server delay on dial up? 1 of 5 "Bill Mayhew" 13 lines 4-JAN-1988 22:46 -< Possibly a chatty modem? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- This is an off-the-wall, I-don't-have-modems-on-a-DECserver response, but... I have sometimes seen the same behavior with some modems on "direct" dialup lines (non-DECservered ... non-DECserved? whatever)... if the modem is not configured for "quiet" operation. That is, if the modem is putting out any kind of text to say "hi, I just got a carrier and this incoming call is ready for you guys" to the CPU, autobaud would not work for a few seconds, since that text was being treated as autobaud characters by the CPU. You may, or may not, have the same problem with a non-quiet modem on a DECserver. (Also unfortunately, not all modems can be put into "quiet" mode to begin with.) Bill Mayhew Village Systems Workshop Inc PO Box 642 Natick MA 01760 617-237-0238 ================================================================ Note 865.2 terminal server delay on dial up? 2 of 5 "Chris Erskine" 9 lines 5-JAN-1988 06:58 -< 1 cause of delay >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- I have a delay of 3 to 5 seconds after connecting to the modem but in my case I know what and why the problem is. I use R-V 2400 baud modems with MNP. After connection and carrier present, the modem goes through MNP startup sequence which takes 3-5 seconds even if the remote modem does not have MNP. Chris Chris Erskine 23 S Holcomb Clarkston, MI 48016 VAX-58 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT (313) 524-8836 ================================================================ Note 865.3 terminal server delay on dial up? 3 of 5 "Tony Carter" 6 lines 8-JAN-1988 15:16 -< Rainbow connect delay >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- I'm note sure if this is a similar case, but, I use a Rainbow as my terminal which is connected to a Decserver 200. After powering it on and typing T (to enter terminal emulation mode) the WAIT light comes on and I have to wait 2-3 seconds before I can talk to the terminal server. It has never bothered me enough to investigate it further, but there may be a connection here. Tony Carter P.O. Box 846 Middleton, MA 01949 (617) 245-6600 ================================================================ Note 865.4 terminal server delay on dial up? 4 of 5 "John K. Doyle, Jr." 21 lines 8-JAN-1988 22:57 -< DF224 *IS* Chatty >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Are you using a DF224 (DEC scholar or variant) modem? This one IS a "chatty" modem as mentioned in .1. When it answers a phone call, it sends one of several text string to the device it is attached to (in your case the terminal server). If the incoming phone call is at the speed to which the DF224 has as ITS default, it will send "Attached" to the terminal server. If the phone call is coming in at a speed different than the DF224's default, it also sends "Speed: 1200" or some such to the terminal server AT THE DEFAULT SPEED. AFTER it has sent this, it then switches to the speed of the incoming call. There is no way to disable this behavior as far as I can tell. Our DF224 is connected to a DECSA-style terminal server. Actually, I amazed that the auto-baud works considering what the DF224 is doing. However, since it WORK I count myself lucky as this is one of the few situations where the DF224 has NOT taken a large bite out of me. By the way, I think the reason that it DOES work is that the Terminal Server "default" speed for auto-baud lines is 9600. Because of this, the terminal server must see the VAX-59 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT "ATTACHED" and "SPEED" messages coming in at either 300,1200, or 2400 as just garbage. I guess the terminal server is either looking for successive carriage returns or a carriage return that is fairly well isolated in time from OTHER characters. John K. Doyle, Jr. Steiner, Levi & Co. 2550 Mercantile Drive Suite C Rancho Cordova, CA 95670 (916) 638-2600 ================================================================ Note 865.5 terminal server delay on dial up? 5 of 5 "Bill Mayhew" 10 lines 9-JAN-1988 17:31 -< Quieting down a DF224 >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- One way to reduce the problem mentioned in .4 with the DF224 is to put it in "abbreviated response" mode. This is selected through the modem's Soft Select menu; connect from your VAX outbound to the modem, or plug a terminal into it temporarily instead, type ^B % Return, and follow the bouncing ball. This doesn't completely solve the problem by any means, but it does reduce it by changing "Attached" to a simple "A" ("a"?), the speed message to "s:1200" etc. There's no way I know of to gag it altogether, either. Bill Mayhew Village Systems Workshop Inc PO Box 642 Natick MA 01760 617-237-0238 VAX-60 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 866.0 VMS 4.7 is here! 49 replies "George Merriman CCA/NY" 5 lines 5-JAN-1988 21:07 ---------------------------------------------------------------- VMS 4.7 came into a client's site today. I updated a 4.6 system running on a MicroVAX II in about 45 min., not including backups. I'll keep you posted if I run into any problems. George Merriman Cambridge Computer Associates 56 Beaver Street 3rd Floor New York NY 10004 212-425-5830 ================================================================ Note 866.6 VMS 4.7 is here! 6 of 49 "Brian Tillman, Smiths Industries." 1 line 8-JAN-1988 13:33 -< Here also. >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- V4.7 arrived in Grand Rapids, Michigan 1/8/88. Brian Tillman Lear Siegler, Inc. 4141 Eastern Ave. MS121 Grand Rapids, MI 49518-8727 (616)241-8425 ================================================================ Note 866.12 VMS 4.7 is here! 12 of 49 "Larry Kilgallen" 7 lines 11-JAN-1988 10:00 -< On the subject of Microfiche >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | By the way, cover letter says fiche is now a separate (read: | YOU PAY) item... Oh, yes, it has been a separate item since VMS V4.4. The point is that those who pay expect to get, and V4.7 has not really "arrived" until all components required by a site (i.e., those they ordered) have arrived. Larry Kilgallen VAX-61 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Box 81, MIT Station Cambridge, MA 02139-0901 ================================================================ Note 866.13 VMS 4.7 is here! 13 of 49 "Bob Hassinger" 12 lines 11-JAN-1988 10:17 -< RIGHT! Need SIG action. >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | .. The point is that those who pay expect to get, and V4.7 has | not really "arrived" until all components required by a site | (i.e., those they ordered) have arrived. CORRECT Larry. This is really getting out of hand! What is the VAX SIG going to do at the Spring Symposium (or elsewhere) to focus attention and get action on this fiche problem? Bob H Bob Hassinger Liberty Mutual Research Center 71 Frankland Road Hopkinton, MA 01748 617-435-9061 ================================================================ Note 866.14 VMS 4.7 is here! 14 of 49 "Lee K. Gleason" 14 lines 11-JAN-1988 13:10 -< It could be worse... >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | This is really getting out of hand! My DEC salesman is trying to convince my management that in order to get the microfiche, we will have to order the VMS source kit ($20K plus)!!! Has anyone else come across this little bit of disinformation at their DEC office? Lee K. Gleason Control-G Consultants 2416 Branard #D VAX-62 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Houston TX 77098 713/528-1859 ================================================================ Note 866.15 VMS 4.7 is here! 15 of 49 "Terry Kennedy" 13 lines 11-JAN-1988 17:05 -< Hogwash! >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | My DEC salesman is trying to convince my management that in | order to get the microfiche, we will have to order the VMS | source kit ($20K plus)!!! Don't believe it! The order code for a fiche license is QL001-FR and it costs $500.00. Terry Kennedy 95 Mohawk Trail Ringwood, N.J. 07456 (201) 435-1890 ================================================================ Note 866.16 VMS 4.7 is here! 16 of 49 "JEFF KILLEEN" 6 lines 11-JAN-1988 17:45 -< BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU ASK FOR >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | What is the VAX SIG going to do at the Spring Symposium (or | elsewhere) to focus attention and get action on this fiche | problem? DEC could solve this problem very easily. Hold up the VMS FCS till the fiche kits are ready to go. Be careful what you ask for - you might get it! JEFF KILLEEN 31 HOPEDALE ST. HOPEDALE, MA. 01747 617-478-8098 VAX-63 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 866.19 VMS 4.7 is here! 19 of 49 "JIM PALMER" 25 lines 12-JAN-1988 17:30 -< Fiche is a layered product >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- The issue of late fiche with respect to software releases is very serious problem. Much like yesterdays newspaper, the value of the fiche is severely diminished if its received just before the next release. If anything, I would like to see EARLY release of the fiche. This would serve as a kind of preview of coming attractions and would aid planning at my site immensely. With clusters, complex networks, and 3rd party layered products that do not follow any standardized method of installation or method of operation, knowing about the underlying O/S support is a must!!!!. I belive this will become a major issue with V5.0. JIM PALMER 3 BROOKDALE IRVINE, CA. 92714-3338 (714) 458-3028 ================================================================ Note 866.20 VMS 4.7 is here! 20 of 49 "Stuart Renes" 5 lines 12-JAN-1988 19:00 -< V4.7 here in Big D! >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Received 4.7 here in Dallas area on Monday, January 11th. NO installation problems so far on an 8530, VAXstation 2000 and 11/725! Stuart Renes AT&T Technologies, Inc. Mail Stop: 2793 3000 Skyline Dr. Mesquite, TX 75149 (214) 288-2286 VAX-64 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 866.21 VMS 4.7 is here! 21 of 49 "Larry Kilgallen" 16 lines 12-JAN-1988 19:21 ---------------------------------------------------------------- | .19 | | I don't recall if the price is bound to the CPU type. (we have | 750's). A quick look at our maintenance contract indicates that | the order number is QL001-KR. The "L" in the second position means a CPU model independent item. Larry Kilgallen Box 81, MIT Station Cambridge, MA 02139-0901 ================================================================ Note 866.24 VMS 4.7 is here! 24 of 49 "Alan E. Frisbie" 0 lines 13-JAN-1988 01:03 -< And MicroVMS 4.7 still hasn't arrived in Los Angeles >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Alan E. Frisbie Flying Disk Systems, Inc. 4759 Round Top Drive Los Angeles, CA 90065 ================================================================ Note 866.25 VMS 4.7 is here! 25 of 49 "John Osudar" 25 lines 13-JAN-1988 15:21 -< re: 866.16 -< BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU ASK FOR >- >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | | What is the VAX SIG going to do at the Spring Symposium (or | elsewhere) to focus attention and get action on this fiche | problem? VAX-65 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT For a lot of people, particularly those who need the fiche (to modify components, either DEC-supplied or third party, that they require in order to run VMS), the VMS distribution kit is next to useless unless they DO have the fiche. So, while it would be nice to get the kit as soon as it's ready to ship, it would really make more sense to have the fiche ready to go when the kit is shipped. What I'd like to know is, what is the source of the delay in getting the fiche shipped? Is it a production problem? Certainly, if the software is going out the door, the listings for that software should be available for transfer to fiche. If it's just a production problem, it would seem that DEC ought to find a way to solve it. (Maybe we couldn't justify complaining about it when the fiche came with the software; but now that we are paying for it, I think we have cause to scream loudly when it takes weeks/months to get the fiche.) John Osudar Argonne National Laboratory 9700 S. Cass Ave. Bldg. 205 A-051 Argonne, IL 60439-4837 (312) 972-7505 ================================================================ Note 866.28 VMS 4.7 is here! 28 of 49 "Bob Hassinger" 15 lines 14-JAN-1988 11:36 -< before we started paying... >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | .. (Maybe we couldn't justify complaining about it when the | fiche came with the software; but now that we are paying for it, | I think we have cause to scream loudly when it takes | weeks/months to get the fiche.) Odd... it seems as if *before* we started paying for the fiche, it did come *with* the software kits most of the time... Jeff's warning not withstanding, I agree strongly with John and I think the SIG should attack the issue at the Spring Symposium. Bob Hassinger Liberty Mutual Research Center 71 Frankland Road Hopkinton, MA 01748 617-435-9061 VAX-66 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 866.30 VMS 4.7 is here! 30 of 49 "Alan E. Frisbie" 3 lines 14-JAN-1988 21:09 -< Finally! >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | | -< And MicroVMS 4.7 still hasn't arrived in Los Angeles >- It just showed up about an hour ago via UPS. Alan E. Frisbie Flying Disk Systems, Inc. 4759 Round Top Drive Los Angeles, CA 90065 ================================================================ Note 866.33 VMS 4.7 is here! 33 of 49 "Jamie Hanrahan" 6 lines 15-JAN-1988 18:57 -< DHV11 DMA bug fixed >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- The 4.6 YFDRIVER bug, which caused DHV11's (and, by some reports, DHU11's) with /DMA enabled to hang upon ^Y, ^O, etc., under 4.6, is fixed via a patch in 4.7. So all of you who replaced your 4.6 YFDRIVER with the one from 4.5 should put the 4.6 edition back before applying the 4.7 update. Jamie Hanrahan Simpact Associates 9210 Sky Park Court San Diego, CA 92123 619-565-1865 VAX-67 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 866.41 VMS 4.7 is here! 41 of 49 "Stuart Renes" 15 lines 25-JAN-1988 15:06 -< V4.7 experiences at AT&T >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- VMS 4.7 comes with a *NEW* TTDRIVER.EXE image which was supposed to fix problems with windowing software on VPW software. In fact, the new TTDRIVER broke a pseudo-terminal driver that had been working just fine and dandy till 4.7! Also, I notice that my DECserver terminal lines don't come up as /DIALUP or /MODEM as with earlier releases of the LAT. I haven't had any luck in making the LAT Qio interface work, however. All I get is "Device timeout" from the server.... Anybody have better luck? Stuart Renes AT&T Technologies, Inc. Mail Stop: 2793 3000 Skyline Dr. Mesquite, TX 75149 (214) 288-2286 ================================================================ Note 866.42 VMS 4.7 is here! 42 of 49 "Larry Kilgallen" 2 lines 25-JAN-1988 16:54 -< Do you have any specifics on TTDRIVER change? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | In fact, the new TTDRIVER broke a pseudo-terminal driver that | had been working just fine and dandy till 4.7! Larry Kilgallen Box 81, MIT Station Cambridge, MA 02139-0901 VAX-68 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 866.44 VMS 4.7 is here! 44 of 49 "Bill Mayhew" 5 lines 26-JAN-1988 22:48 -< re: .43... "work correctly?" >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Can you be more specific about "work correctly"... what problems are supposed to be fixed? (I use terminal emulator windows heavily on my 4.5, now 4.6, VAXstation 2000 and have not had any problems I could blame on the emulator or TTDRIVER.) Bill Mayhew Village Systems Workshop Inc PO Box 642 Natick MA 01760 617-237-0238 ================================================================ Note 866.45 VMS 4.7 is here! 45 of 49 "Frank J. Nagy" 10 lines 27-JAN-1988 08:18 -< Using LAT $QIO under V4.6 OK >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- < Note 866.41 by NODE::US108249 "Stuart Renes" > | | I haven't had any luck in making the LAT Qio interface work, | however. All I get is "Device timeout" from the server.... | Anybody have better luck? I gotten the "undocumented" $QIO function which returns the server name and port name associated with an LTAn terminal to work just fine. (By "undocumented", I mean that Digital did not document this function in the V4.6 Release Notes, but the I/O function is in the $IODEF macro and include files for FORTRAN, etc.). Frank J. Nagy Fermilab PO Box 500 MS/220 Batavia, IL 60510 (312)840-4935 VAX-69 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 866.48 VMS 4.7 is here! 48 of 49 "Stuart Renes" 11 lines 28-JAN-1988 11:50 -< VMS V4.7 TTDRIVER manifestations >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- My pseudo-terminal port driver now returns me DATA OVERRUN errors during long bursts of output, even though the QIO's are single character. Worked fine for months till 4.7. Also, under VWS, I *NOW* have a problem with some WT: windowing stuff that worked ok before... specifically trying to abort some of the demo displays in the [VWSDEMO] area of the VAXstation 2000 system disk....window now gets hung... ...this may only be superficial evidence, however. Stuart Renes AT&T Technologies, Inc. Mail Stop: 2793 3000 Skyline Dr. Mesquite, TX 75149 (214) 288-2286 ================================================================ Note 868.0 CAI's, where are you? 2 replies "G. Del Merritt" 7 lines 8-JAN-1988 10:48 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Are VMSCAI and EDTCAI (shudder) still available? If so, have they been updated to reflect 4.x and other changes? Is there a TPUCAI? Is there a Library submission that does it better than the old CAI's? I have a gaggle of new-from-big-blue's users about to descend on my VAX, and would like to give them a head start whilst I gather notes together for a quick 1/2 day intro... G. Del Merritt 55 Walkers Brook Drive Reading, MA 01867 VAX-70 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 868.1 CAI's, where are you? 1 of 2 "Jonathan M. Prigot" 6 lines 8-JAN-1988 11:24 -< Self-Paced Instruction >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- They (or similar, at least) are available from DEC Educational Services. They have Self-Paced instruction courses on Utilities and Commands (text and media course) and Intro to EVE (CAI). I just got the new catalogue for these and other Self-Paced instruction courses. Call 1-800-332-5656 Ext 106 for details. Jonathan M. Prigot W.R. Grace & Company 55 Hayden Avenue Lexington, MA 02173 617-861-6600 x2148 ================================================================ Note 868.2 CAI's, where are you? 2 of 2 "Rytis T. Balciunas" 6 lines 25-JAN-1988 07:58 -< Proceed with caution.. >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Proceed with caution: I ordered VAX BASIC programming from Ed Services, they told me it was at or near the latest rev (3.1). What I got was 1.5 inches of booklets that were for BASIC 2.4. The old VMS and EDT CAIs were for version 4.0 when I got them a year or so ago... RYTIS T. BALCIUNAS CALGON CARBON CORPORATION PO BOX 717 PITTSBURGH PA 15230-0717 (412)787-6784 VAX-71 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 869.1 Has VMS Services for DECnet-DOS been fixed? 1 of 4 "Jack Patteeuw" 3 lines 12-JAN-1988 13:17 -< Same subject, different question >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Several months ago DEC announced that VMS Service for MS-DOS would be bundled with DECNET-VMS. Can anyone confirm this with VMS/DECNET V4.7 ? Jack Patteeuw Ford Motor Co. Electrical and Electronics Division 31630 Wyoming Livonia, MI 48150 313-323-8643 ================================================================ Note 869.3 Has VMS Services for DECnet-DOS been fixed? 3 of 4 "Mark Schell (919) 773-7040" 16 lines 17-JAN-1988 22:10 -< License free - media, pay! >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Being a Digital person, (but certainly not speaking for the entire corporation!), here's the current situation as I understand it: As of VMS 4.6, the license for VMS services was bundled with the DECnet license. This means that if you bought DECnet, you also bought VMS Services. You still have to buy the media for your VAX in order to have the actual software. You still need to buy the client kit for IBM PC's, but the VAXmate client kit comes with the server media and doc kit. I've heard nothing about this changing in the future. Mark Schell DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORPORATION 8025 NORTH POINT BLVD SUITE 100 WEST WINSTON SALEM NC 27106 VAX-72 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 870.0 LAVc functionality and constraints 18 replies "Bill Mayhew" 10 lines 12-JAN-1988 19:17 ---------------------------------------------------------------- I have two questions about LAVCs: 1. Considering the way LAVCs are marketed, and the ways satellites are configured typically-- does the LAVc software do anything to deal with the current BACKUP restriction that prevents doing backups directly to tape across the network? 2. Anybody know just why it is that LAVc requires a minimum of an RD54 on the boot member... and, assuming it does, is there any reason why a MicroVAX 2000 equipped with an RD54 couldn't work as a boot member? (Technical, not marketing, reasons please {grin}) Bill Mayhew Village Systems Workshop Inc PO Box 642 Natick MA 01760 617-237-0238 ================================================================ Note 870.1 LAVc functionality and constraints 1 of 18 "Larry Kilgallen" 31 lines 12-JAN-1988 19:35 -< LAVC backup should be no problem >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- The obvious way to do backup in LAVc or other clusters is to run the Backup image on the CPU which has the tape drive and mount the disk so that it is accessible from that cpu. In the LAVc case there are only two possible backup problems I can envision: 1. Node with tape drive has a weak CPU Typical configurations would make the boot node no less powerful than any satellite (unless one is trying to use up left-over Comets), so this should not be a problem. (The node with the tape drive, and therefore the Backup process, is the one doing the CRC's. VAX-73 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT 2. Cannot backup a served system disk at least not without leaving it mounted, which true paranoids would never do. This should not be a problem if your boot node is the one with the tape drive. Served user disks can be dismounted with the system running, unless you are using them for page and swap files. In that case, you could have an alternate boot configuration which did not use the local page and swap files, just for the purpose of backing up that disk. (Obviously if you used the local disk *only* for page and swap we would not be discussing this). Larry Kilgallen Box 81, MIT Station Cambridge, MA 02139-0901 ================================================================ Note 870.2 LAVc functionality and constraints 2 of 18 "Dale E. Coy (505) 667-3270" 12 lines 12-JAN-1988 22:33 -< The RD54 restriction is artificial >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- The RD54 "minimum" for LAVC is a totally artificial restriction enforced by KITINSTAL, and can be hacked out of KITINSTAL with very little effort. I can't see any reason a 2000 wouldn't work. Of course, the artificial restriction is based on DEC's computations of minimum size for VMS plus page and swap files for at least 2 CPUs plus something for the users (if any). There's no way to avoid having minimal page and swap files for a 2nd CPU on the boot node, during the brief time you're bringing up the satellite for the first time (as far as I can see, anyway). How small can you make VMS? Now add just a few thousand blocks, and go for LAVC. DALE E. COY LOS ALAMOS NATIONAL LAB PO BOX 1663, MS J957 LOS ALAMOS, NM 87545 505-667-3270 VAX-74 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 870.3 LAVc functionality and constraints 3 of 18 "John Osudar" 5 lines 13-JAN-1988 15:29 -< Problem may be RD53 is too small >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- All I know is, I run a VAXstation 2000 satellite that has copies of most of the VMS system files on its local disk (for performance considerations). The local disk is an RD53, and it has under 15000 free blocks left. Can't see how you could run a reasonable boot member from an RD53... John Osudar Argonne National Laboratory 9700 S. Cass Ave. Bldg. 205 A-051 Argonne, IL 60439-4837 (312) 972-7505 ================================================================ Note 870.4 LAVc functionality and constraints 4 of 18 "gerson cohen" 8 lines 13-JAN-1988 16:11 -< BACKUP on LAVC is good >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Having just gotten up an LAVC (see 813.*), I can attest to the functionality of backup to tape. I backed up approx 612,000 blocks from a served RA81 on a satellite to a TU81+ on my 8530 in about 1 hour, 15 min. This included verification and used two tapes at 6250 with group=25. This timing is significantly better than I have experienced previously with a straight DECNET copy or a backup across DECNET into a remote saveset. Fortunately, my good drive is on an 8530! gerson cohen nih bldg 2 rm 312 bethesda md 20205 301-496-4295 VAX-75 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 870.5 LAVc functionality and constraints 5 of 18 "Bill Mayhew" 23 lines 14-JAN-1988 20:36 -< Room to maneuver on an RD32 >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- re .3: In a number of situations, one does not need full-tilt VMS. My VAXstation runs stand-alone on an RD32 and MicroVMS takes up somewhere between 15 and 20 Mb, leaving 40-50,000 blocks for a couple or three layered products and my own work (mostly software development in C). Not exactly spacious, but it works. I have some end-user (vs. programmer) installations that are even better off. This all depends on _careful_ selection of installed MicroVMS options, at the "option" (not Kit) level, and pruning back page and swap files to their smallest usable sizes, of course. Mixing NOTES topics, this area of pruning the system is what concerns me most about attempting to use a full-VMS update kit on a MicroVMS system -- is full VMS shipped in about 25 or 30 save sets, like MicroVMS, or would one have to "get down and dirty" and strip out what isn't needed, one file at a time? (It also is an area that concerns me about the pending "formal" merger of VMS and MicroVMS, and the predictions that the facilities provided will involve installing everything and then removing what isn't required. It seems likely that a 40Mb disk may well not cut it in that scenario... further pricing VMS-based systems out of the small-business marketplace.) Bill Mayhew Village Systems Workshop Inc PO Box 642 Natick MA 01760 617-237-0238 VAX-76 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 870.6 LAVc functionality and constraints 6 of 18 "Larry Kilgallen" 13 lines 14-JAN-1988 20:55 -< VMS V5 Tailoring Design Center is "Tailor-off" >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | | (It also is an area that concerns me about the pending "formal" | merger of VMS and MicroVMS, and the predictions that the | facilities provided will involve installing everything and then | removing what isn't required. The latest I heard (on a tape from Anaheim) is that the subject phrase means that tailor-off (where you have space to hold it all during installation) will be *easier*, but tailor-on (where you do not have that space) will still be possible. It may be that they want you to modify son-of-vmsimages.dat in order to tailor-on. Larry Kilgallen Box 81, MIT Station Cambridge, MA 02139-0901 ================================================================ Note 870.7 LAVc functionality and constraints 7 of 18 "Dale E. Coy (505) 667-3270" 9 lines 14-JAN-1988 23:39 -< But who knows about 5.0? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- VMS 4.6 shipped as 4 save sets: VMS046.A REQUIRED. LIBRARY. OPTIONAL. (Plus the mandatory update which was .A, .B, .C) VMS 4.7 shipped as 3 save sets: VMS047.A, VMS047.B, and VMS047.C DALE E. COY LOS ALAMOS NATIONAL LAB PO BOX 1663, MS J957 VAX-77 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT LOS ALAMOS, NM 87545 505-667-3270 ================================================================ Note 870.8 LAVc functionality and constraints 8 of 18 "Kevin Angley" 3 lines 15-JAN-1988 17:12 -< RE: .7 >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Re: .7 - the difference of course is that 4.6 was a full kit that you could install from scratch with. 4.7 is an update only. A new user would get both kits. Kevin Angley 3301 Terminal Drive Raleigh, NC 27604 (919) 890-1416 ================================================================ Note 870.9 LAVc functionality and constraints 9 of 18 "Bill Mayhew" 6 lines 15-JAN-1988 21:36 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Re: .7, .8, et possibly al... It sounds to me then that one could not reasonably use a VMS update kit to upgrade a MicroVMS system that was (intentionally) "incomplete" ... short of digging into the KITINSTAL or whatever and dealing with the "useful" parts, by hand. Yes? Bill Mayhew Village Systems Workshop Inc PO Box 642 Natick MA 01760 617-237-0238 VAX-78 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 870.10 LAVc functionality and constraints 10 of 18 "Dale E. Coy (505) 667-3270" 5 lines 16-JAN-1988 00:59 -< Odd releases, maybe? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- The "odd" releases (4.7) would almost work as you'd like. The patches would gripe about stuff not being there, but wouldn't crumble. The 20 .EXEs would be added to your system if not already there (4.7 example), but most of them are probably there, anyway. DALE E. COY LOS ALAMOS NATIONAL LAB PO BOX 1663, MS J957 LOS ALAMOS, NM 87545 505-667-3270 ================================================================ Note 870.12 LAVc functionality and constraints 12 of 18 "John Azzoli" 5 lines 17-JAN-1988 12:20 -< 4.7 Save sets >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- The release notes for 4.7 mention that saveset .B is used for VMS upgrades and .C is used for MicroVMS. John Azzoli Hoechst Celanese Research Division 86 Morris Avenue Summit, NJ 07901 (201) 522-7980 VAX-79 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 870.13 LAVc functionality and constraints 13 of 18 "Kevin Angley" 6 lines 17-JAN-1988 14:00 -< But it is still the same kit, isn't it? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- The *only* thing VMS047.C contributes is a modification to WELCOME.TXT to say MicroVMS. Now, if this is the only difference between upgrading VMS and MicroVMS to version 4.7, it sure would make life a lot easier if Digital would admit it. Kevin Angley 3301 Terminal Drive Raleigh, NC 27604 (919) 890-1416 ================================================================ Note 870.14 LAVc functionality and constraints 14 of 18 "Mark Schell (919) 773-7040" 19 lines 17-JAN-1988 22:23 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Couple of issues: I would expect that a MicroVAX 2000 with a RD54 would work just fine, however, I'd wonder about the performance. As the 2000's are a busless machine, the Ethernet/disk performance would be the critical issue in it being a boot node. It could probably support only 1 other node. Is that useful? Remember that VMS is required for an LAVC - don't count blocks required by MicroVMS and multiply by 2. VMS takes much more, although you could probably tailor it. From what I've heard about the merger, VMS will unload itself in a certain order, and when it runs out of space, it will quit, and then let you decide what you want. I'd expect that a RD53 might be the minimum, tho I suppose a RD32 would be nice for a low end system. Mark Schell DIGITAL EQUIPMENT CORPORATION 8025 NORTH POINT BLVD SUITE 100 WEST WINSTON SALEM NC 27106 VAX-80 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 870.15 LAVc functionality and constraints 15 of 18 "Bill Mayhew" 20 lines 18-JAN-1988 15:53 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Regarding the performance of a hypothetical 2000/RD54-booted LAVc, I'm considering a situation where the satellites would definitely have their own local disks, but simply that the entire system wants to be managed (in all senses of that word) like one system rather than n. Overall, the amount of traffic on the Ethernet should be low, and similarly the demand on the boot member should be relatively low. If things "go well" I may get the opportunity to test all this out in the next few months, and will report back. I just wanted to have some assurance that I wasn't overlooking anything really stupid in contemplating this move. "Remember that VMS is required for an LAVC"... brings up another interesting question. Exactly why is VMS required, i.e. what does it have that MicroVMS doesn't that LAVCs need? I really wish that when Digital announces "you gotta have x and y to run z" they would give at least some semblance of a technical explanation as to why... sometimes the constraints that Digital thinks are constraints don't apply, in certain real-world situations (e.g. the MicroVAX 2000 as an LAVc boot member, or for that matter an RD53-based MicroVAX II). Sigh... Bill Mayhew Village Systems Workshop Inc PO Box 642 Natick MA 01760 617-237-0238 VAX-81 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 870.16 LAVc functionality and constraints 16 of 18 "Dale E. Coy (505) 667-3270" 8 lines 18-JAN-1988 18:59 -< Don't forget temporary Page and Swap files >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- That's what I thought you were thinking of, Bill. When you do your disk space computations, remember that you do need a temporary, minimal size set of files on the boot node in order to initially boot the satellite. These temporary files go away when the page and swap files are established on the satellite node. Can't imagine you would run things to where there weren't a few thousand blocks of "scratch space", but it is a consideration. DALE E. COY LOS ALAMOS NATIONAL LAB PO BOX 1663, MS J957 LOS ALAMOS, NM 87545 505-667-3270 ================================================================ Note 870.17 LAVc functionality and constraints 17 of 18 "John Osudar" 7 lines 20-JAN-1988 14:48 -< no cluster support >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | "Remember that VMS is required for an LAVC"... brings up | another interesting question. Exactly why is VMS required, i.e. | what does it have that MicroVMS doesn't that LAVCs need? As I recall, MicroVMS does not include any form of cluster support. (i.e. some of the code required to support any type of cluster is missing from MicroVMS) John Osudar Argonne National Laboratory 9700 S. Cass Ave. Bldg. 205 A-051 Argonne, IL 60439-4837 (312) 972-7505 VAX-82 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 871.0RA60 and the art of avoiding 220 volt power 18 replies "Larry Kilgallen" 20 lines 13-JAN-1988 10:06 ---------------------------------------------------------------- I am interested in the possibility of running an RA60 disk drive at a site which does not have 220 volt electrical service. At a site which *does* have 220 volts and a single RA60, the arrangement is as follows: H9CAB-AA cabinet contains an RA60 with a 110 volt power cord plugged into an 874-D device at the bottom rear of the cabinet. 874-D has a 220 volt cord plugged into the appropriate external socket. So what is the function of the 874-D with only one drive? I realize it probably balances the load of 110 volt RA60's across the 220 volt supply if one has a cabinet-full, but in the single drive configuration would plugging the RA60 directly into a wall outlet work? Is there any chance that DEC would support it? (I realize I am asking for guesstimates here. I don't require Ken Olsen's signature, just some hope that Field Service would not turn their back on the site when they saw the arrangement). Larry Kilgallen Box 81, MIT Station Cambridge, MA 02139-0901 ================================================================ Note 871.4 RA60 and the art of avoiding 220 volt power 4 of 18 "Dale E. Coy (505) 667-3270" 12 lines 14-JAN-1988 00:30 -< I wouldn't have a doubt >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- We had several (3, I think) RA-81s plugged into regular sockets (instead of the power controller in the rack) for over a year before we finally got around to doing it "right". There was no detectable difference in reliability between these and the other bunch which was done "right" from the start. We have full DEC maintenance, and they never said a word. In fact, they even hooked up the power sequencing cables so all the drives wouldn't start at once. VAX-83 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Of course, your field service mileage may vary... DALE E. COY LOS ALAMOS NATIONAL LAB PO BOX 1663, MS J957 LOS ALAMOS, NM 87545 505-667-3270 ================================================================ Note 871.5 RA60 and the art of avoiding 220 volt power 5 of 18 "Terry Kennedy" 31 lines 14-JAN-1988 03:40 -< Power sermonette... >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- 1) I have a cabinet with 2 RA60's in it (ordered & delivered from DEC) which has a 30-amp 110 volt plug on it (L5-30P). This is the same twist-lock plug that DEC uses on 11/44's, etc. If you want a DEC power controller in this configuration, give me a call at (201) 435-0252. 2) If (and ONLY if) the equipment wants 220 volt power and does NOT use 110 for ANYTHING, you can use two of the three phase legs to run it. This is normal practice for IBM gear, by the way. The giveaway is that the power cord wires are black, red and green, not black, white and green. In theory, anything with a white wire wants 110, anything without is either 220 or multiphase. In 3-phase power, there are two kinds, Delta and Wye. With one there is 208 between the any two phase leads, and 110 between a phase lead and neutral. With the other, you still have 208 between phases, but the voltage to neutral is up in the low 200's as well. 3) Regarding experimenting with 2), be *sure* that the cabinet is grounded. [green wire] 4) DEC power cords are generally color-coded blue, brown, green/yellow spiral. That is the international standard because the US concept of one side of the AC line (neutral) being at the same voltage reference as ground is not universal. Again, note that 'at the same voltage reference' should not be construed as 'is connected to'... VAX-84 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Terry Kennedy 95 Mohawk Trail Ringwood, N.J. 07456 (201) 435-1890 ================================================================ Note 871.6 RA60 and the art of avoiding 220 volt power 6 of 18 "Robert Gerber" 11 lines 14-JAN-1988 09:16 -< Wall outlet ok...but .... >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- I too have run an RA60 plugged straight into a standard wall socket because electrical work had been delayed. The three high cabinet requires 110 Volts/ 30 AMPS grounded. The four high cabinet wants three phase power, but each drive only sees one hot leg along with the neutral and ground wires. --> Therefore if you have strange electrical problems, you would want to get three high cabinets.... However if you ever plan to get a VAX on the larger end - you will need the three phase service to make it run. Robert Gerber Gillette Co Tech Services Dept 4U-3 1 Gillette Park Boston, MA 02106 617/463-3636 ================================================================ Note 871.7 RA60 and the art of avoiding 220 volt power 7 of 18 "George Merriman CCA/NY" 45 lines 14-JAN-1988 15:24 -< more power notes >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | In theory, anything with a white wire wants 110, anything | without is either 220 or multiphase. In fact, anything with a white wire wants this wire to be connected to the neutral leg of the service. It has nothing to do with the service voltage. | In 3-phase power, there are two kinds, Delta and Wye. With one | there is 208 between the any two phase leads, and 110 between a VAX-85 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT | phase lead and neutral. With the other, you still have 208 | between phases, but the voltage to neutral is up in the low | 200's as well. The connection scheme (Delta or Wye) has nothing to do with the service voltage. A common primary distribution scheme uses 4160V delta connected three phase. In a computer room in a commercial or industrial space you are most likely to run into a 120/208V nominal three phase four wire (Wye-connected) service. The exact voltage will vary across installations and with time, but ought to be within about 5% of the nominal under load most of the time. True delta connected services are usually found with heavy electrical equipment in factories or building HVAC rooms. There is NO neutral with most delta connected services -- any voltage you measure between a phase and some neutral somewhere is actually a residual potential to earth. Sometimes three phase four wire is distributed without the neutral when it is not needed by the connected equipment. I doubt (and hope) you will ever find this in a computer room. If you do, however, resist the urge to pick up another neutral or earth connection to get 120V -- it is very bad practice and not code. Sometimes one phase of a three phase delta connected service is bonded to earth. I don't have my NEC handy, but I think that in this case the earthed phase is color-coded white and might be termed a neutral. I have never seen such a service. I have been warned by people who have seen it not to confuse it with single phase three wire because the box looks just the same inside -- two fused and one unfused legs. Once again, if your equipment REALLY MUST have 110 or 220 volts I expect you will have to invest in some transformers unless you are on a rural domestic service. In most cases what you will find is 120V and 208V. George Merriman Cambridge Computer Associates 56 Beaver Street 3rd Floor New York NY 10004 212-425-5830 VAX-86 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 871.8 RA60 and the art of avoiding 220 volt power 8 of 18 "Terry Kennedy" 30 lines 15-JAN-1988 01:55 -< Take 2 >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | In theory, anything with a white wire wants 110, anything | without is either 220 or multiphase. | | In fact, anything with a white wire wants this wire to be | connected to the neutral leg of the service. It has nothing to | do with the service voltage. As you point out further on in your reply, 110 is normally only found between a phase leg and neutral. Therefore, if neutral is used, it will be white (in the US). In 3-phase power, there are two kinds, Delta and Wye... | The connection scheme (Delta or Wye) has nothing to do with the | service voltage... Agreed. However, it is important to be aware of the differences between them if one is looking for 110 somewhere. | I doubt (and hope) you will ever find this in a computer room. | If you do, however, resist the urge to pick up another neutral | or earth connection to get 120V -- it is very bad practice and | not code. You'd be surprised what some electricians do... They see 'three-phase four wire' and take a guess at the fourth wire. I've seen neutral, ground, and an unrelated leg from a different transformer (for 110) all put on the fourth connector. Terry Kennedy 95 Mohawk Trail Ringwood, N.J. 07456 (201) 435-1890 VAX-87 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 871.13 RA60 and the art of avoiding 220 volt power 13 of 18 "Jack Patteeuw" 15 lines 18-JAN-1988 12:08 -< One caution >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- The only thing to watch out for is the starting current, which can be MUCH higher than the running current. This is especially true for multiple drives plugged into the same "circuit". My field engineer told me that the main purpose of the power distribution panel in the bottom is to "sequence" the power up, especially after the building loses and then regains power. I know one site at Ford that had a RA81 on a roll-away cart so they could move it from one system to another. The note on the front said "Please lock wheels before spinning up drive." Now that's scary !! Jack Patteeuw Ford Motor Co. Electrical and Electronics Division 31630 Wyoming Livonia, MI 48150 313-323-8643 ================================================================ Note 871.18 RA60 and the art of avoiding 220 volt power 18 of 18 "Jack Patteeuw" 20 lines 27-JAN-1988 17:59 -< more power stories >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- We just installed a LPS40 which, according to all the site prep info, requires a 220v single phase from a L6-15R receptacle. I was told by our electricians that we could only get 208v 3 phase. This was no problem for DEC however. When the Field Service Engineer came to install the unit she (yes, I said "she") merely opened up the back and changed a jumper (presumably on the main transformer) from "220" to "200". I noticed several taps all the way up to "250". The VT220 console get it's power from the LPS40 and all she did there was VAX-88 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT flip the switch from 110 to 220 !! I also know another site that cut the "third prong" off of the power cable from their MicroVAX, flipped the switch to 220 and are running off of 208 because their data acquisition lab has "grounding" problems ! Now that's scary !!! Jack Patteeuw Ford Motor Co. Electrical and Electronics Division 31630 Wyoming Livonia, MI 48150 313-323-8643 ================================================================ Note 873.0 Trapping expiring passwords 5 replies "FRANK W. CROFT" 5 lines 14-JAN-1988 13:26 ---------------------------------------------------------------- All our passwords expire after 180 days. We have >1500 accounts including All-In-1 and VMS. They all forget to update their passwords when advised by the system to do so at LOGIN time. How can I capture the signal that tells the user it is time to reset the password so I can force him into a SET PASSWORD procedure? FRANK W. CROFT E. I. DuPont P. O. Box 2042 Wilmington, NC 28402 (919) 371-4071 VAX-89 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 873.1 Trapping expiring passwords 1 of 5 "Dale E. Coy (505) 667-3270" 21 lines 14-JAN-1988 23:26 -< One way >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- If none of the Gurus come up with a way to do the capture, this would work: Once a week (or day or whatever), run something which figures out what users have passwords due to expire in the next week. Could be done with a program or a .COM file - several things on the VAX SIG tape would provide prototypes. This program then sets some sort of flag (we tend to do this by putting an oddly-named, zero-length file in the user's LOGIN directory. SYLOGIN checks for the flag, and puts the user in SET PASSWORD (or your own method). It's not perfect, because the user can get out without setting his/her password - but you know they know you know. If all of your users are ALL-IN-1 users, there is some stuff on the OA SIG tape which might help, also. DALE E. COY LOS ALAMOS NATIONAL LAB PO BOX 1663, MS J957 LOS ALAMOS, NM 87545 505-667-3270 VAX-90 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 873.2 Trapping expiring passwords 2 of 5 "Kevin Angley" 4 lines 15-JAN-1988 17:06 -< Will this help you? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Dave Moore has written a little guy that runs from SYLOGIN that sets the symbol PWD_EXPIRED true or false depending on whether the password has expired or not. I will ask him to upload it next week if there is interest. It is written in PASCAL. Kevin Angley 3301 Terminal Drive Raleigh, NC 27604 (919) 890-1416 ================================================================ Note 873.3 Trapping expiring passwords 3 of 5 "John Osudar" 3 lines 15-JAN-1988 22:42 -< how patient are you??? >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Or, you can wait for VMS V5.0, which allegedly has the capability to require users to do a SET PASSWORD before completing login. (that information is from my Anaheim DECUS notes) John Osudar Argonne National Laboratory 9700 S. Cass Ave. Bldg. 205 A-051 Argonne, IL 60439-4837 (312) 972-7505 VAX-91 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 873.5 Trapping expiring passwords 5 of 5 "Dale E. Coy (505) 667-3270" 8 lines 16-JAN-1988 19:34 -< From the SIG Tapes >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- There is some applicable stuff on the DECUS VAX SIG tapes. Take a look at the following: On the VAX87A (Nashville) tape: [VAX87A.BATTELLE.CHECK_PWEXP] (By Mark Oakley). On the VAX84D tape: [KMSKIT.SYSMGR.COMFILE] DALE E. COY LOS ALAMOS NATIONAL LAB PO BOX 1663, MS J957 LOS ALAMOS, NM 87545 505-667-3270 ================================================================ Note 874.0 Fix for PHY_IO requirement in BACKUP 3 replies "gerson cohen" 6 lines 17-JAN-1988 10:05 ---------------------------------------------------------------- A fix to BACKUP is now being distributed by DEC to those who submitted SPRs. With 4.6, BACKUP has required PHY_IO to write to TU81+ drives. The 4.7 patches do not contain this fix and it seems that 5.0 may also lack it. (I am not actually sure whether the fix will be to BACKUP or to TUDRIVER, but the symptom seem only to involve BACKUP). Get your SPRs in now to receive the fix if you may need it! gerson cohen nih bldg 2 rm 312 bethesda md 20205 301-496-4295 VAX-92 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT ================================================================ Note 874.1 Fix for PHY_IO requirement in BACKUP 1 of 3 "G. Del Merritt" 2 lines 20-JAN-1988 10:46 -< sigh >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- geesh. They said at the advanced Q&A in Anaheim that this had been addressed in 4.7! bummer... G. Del Merritt 55 Walkers Brook Drive Reading, MA 01867 ================================================================ Note 876.0 Anyone with experience with MOBIUS? No replies "M. Erik Husby" 12 lines 18-JAN-1988 13:31 ---------------------------------------------------------------- Anyone out there with experience using MOBIUS? Mobius is PC-VAX file server product. I am looking at it for the same reasons I am looking at RAF (see NOTE 799). M. Erik Husby Project Software & Development 14 Story St. Cambridge, MA. 02138 (617)-661-1666 ================================================================ Note 879.0 DECserver 100 session limit bug No replies "Brian Tillman, Smiths Industries." 13 lines 19-JAN-1988 12:13 ---------------------------------------------------------------- There's a problem with version 1.3 of the DECserver 100 software I'd like to share with you. If you are running DECserver 100 V1.3, BL12, you will experience error 724, "Service node session limit reached" when you have only a few sessions on the server if your server has been up for about 320 days. There is a patch for this available from CSC. It replaces the SYS$SYSROOT:[DECSERVER]PS0801ENG.SYS image with another that is BL15. We just started seeing this problem last week. VAX-93 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT A work around would be to just boot your DECserver 100s every 300 days. Brian Tillman Lear Siegler, Inc. 4141 Eastern Ave. MS121 Grand Rapids, MI 49518-8727 (616)241-8425 ================================================================ Note 880.0 Insects abound ! 4 replies "Jack Patteeuw" 29 lines 19-JAN-1988 17:19 ---------------------------------------------------------------- I have recently come across a "bug" in both DECSpell and DECalc that is very interesting. Others (especially those who write code for a living) should watch out that they do not get bitten the same way DEC has !! DECSpell, immediately upon start up, creates an output file and by default it has the same name as the input file with the next generation number. (DECalc automatically creates its output file as soon as you issue any Storage Command (\S).) This all well and good until the following scenario. 1) The user has set the generation retention count to 1 (Don't ask me why but some people do this !) 2) Nothing is written to the output file. 3) The output file is closed and deleted (because we never wrote to it anyway). (ie. you didn't spell anything wrong in DECSpell (obviously not me) or you were trying to read something with DECalc (\ST).) 4) Your input file has been deleted (because of the generation retention count) and you have no output either !! The moral of the story is "Don't even CREATE the output file until you are really certain that you have something to put in it !" Jack Patteeuw VAX-94 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Ford Motor Co. Electrical and Electronics Division 31630 Wyoming Livonia, MI 48150 313-323-8643 ================================================================ Note 880.1 Insects abound ! 1 of 4 "Larry Kilgallen" 8 lines 19-JAN-1988 17:57 -< I'm not sure I like that solution, though... >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | The moral of the story is "Don't even CREATE the output file | until you are really certain that you have something to put in | it !" But it would be impolite to make the user go to a lot of work creating data for (potential) output only to discover that when they EXIT (as distinguished from QUIT) there is no disk quota. Larry Kilgallen Box 81, MIT Station Cambridge, MA 02139-0901 ================================================================ Note 880.2 Insects abound ! 2 of 4 "Jack Patteeuw" 13 lines 20-JAN-1988 06:31 -< But what about ... >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- re: .1 Good point, Larry ! This leads me to the question: Can any explain to me how the VMS Diskquota OVERDRAFT works ? In the old days, under TOPS, there was a similar concept, but it worked more or less the way you would expect. You could create files above your permanent quota and they could be closed and saved until you tried to log out. Log out would "fail" if you were over you quota and "just hanging up" would cause the system to delete .BAK files ! VAX-95 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT Gee, why isn't VMS more like TOPS ! :-} Jack Patteeuw Ford Motor Co. Electrical and Electronics Division 31630 Wyoming Livonia, MI 48150 313-323-8643 ================================================================ Note 880.3 Insects abound ! 3 of 4 "Larry Kilgallen" 41 lines 20-JAN-1988 08:13 -< The Workings of VMS Overdraft Disk Quotas >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- If a program receives status indicating that an open file cannot be extended due to quota limits, it merely makes the same request again, and that time it works if the overdraft quota permits. Note that this does not work for creating new files. I would characterize the implementation of this in the file system calls as sufficient and the use of it by typical programs (from all sources) as highly sporadic. | it worked more or less the way you would expect. You could | create files above your permanent quota and they could be closed | and saved until you tried to log out. Log out would "fail" if | you were over you quota and "just hanging up" would cause the | system to delete .BAK files ! In VMS the STOP/ID command (or $DELPRC system service from another process) provides no context in which unfavored files can be deleted. There are also considerably more questions about which files and where they are on what disks. Since VMS is not restricted to the simplistic association between directories and quotas, such an approach would be quite foreign. In the example which started this topic, for instance, one would not want to have VMS decide that due to circumstances beyond your control (line drop) older versions (the one containing your data) would be deleted and newer versions (the previously discussed *empty file*) would be preserved. | Gee, why isn't VMS more like TOPS ! :-} VAX-96 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT As I remember it from TOPS-10, the idea of separate logged-out and logged-in quotas had conceptual problems even there. VMS has replaced that conceptual problem with a more up-to-date conceptual problem -- which physical terminal should get written into the process termination accounting record in the face of DISCONNECT and CONNECT commands. ;-) Larry Kilgallen Box 81, MIT Station Cambridge, MA 02139-0901 ================================================================ Note 880.4 Insects abound ! 4 of 4 "G. Del Merritt" 11 lines 20-JAN-1988 11:18 -< LOGFAIL to the `rescue' >- ---------------------------------------------------------------- | As I remember it from TOPS-10, the idea of separate logged-out | and logged-in quotas had conceptual problems even there. VMS | has replaced that conceptual problem with a more up-to-date | conceptual problem -- which physical terminal should get written | into the process termination accounting record in the face of | DISCONNECT and CONNECT commands. ;-) but isn't that why you get a LOGFAIL record every time someone chooses the disco process over a new one? 8-) G. Del Merritt 55 Walkers Brook Drive Reading, MA 01867 ================================================================ Note 885.0 VAX DEBUG V4.6-9 Bug on VAX 8550 Processors 4 replies "Offline Submission" 70 lines 22-JAN-1988 14:15 ---------------------------------------------------------------- There is a bug encountered running VAX DEBUG V4.6-9 as shown in the example below. At my site this bug only occurs running on an 8550. I have tried it also on a VAX 11/780, VAX 8600 and MicroVAX II. ONLY the 8550 exhibits the problem. VAX-97 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT After using the DEBUG constructs: "STEP/RETURN" or "SET BREAK/RETURN", when the breakpoint at the RET instruction is reached, the AP machine register has been prematurely restored from the stack. With a "bad" AP register, DEBUG is now unable to examine properly the values that have been passed as arguments. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $ macro /debug /object=ret-bug sys$input: .entry ret_bug,^m<> ; movl 4(ap),r0 ; return our argument as result ret ; .entry main,^m<> ; pushl #1 ; call ret_bug with argument 1 calls #1,ret_bug ; ret ; .end main ; $ link /debug ret-bug $ run /debug ret-bug VAX DEBUG Version V4.6-9 %DEBUG-I-INITIAL, language is MACRO, module set to .MAIN. SET BREAK RET_BUG GO break at routine .MAIN.\RET_BUG: MOVL B^04(AP),R0 EXAMINE %AP, @(%AP) + 4 ! correct ... .MAIN.\RET_BUG\%AP: 7FF2557C 7FF25580: 00000001 STEP/RETURN stepped on return from routine .MAIN.\RET_BUG to .MAIN.\RET_BUG+6: RET ! RET instruction has "not been executed", ! but the %AP has been restored from the ! stack frame giving a bad result for ! examining parameters passed to a routine... EXAMINE %AP, @(%AP) + 4 .MAIN.\RET_BUG\%AP: 7FF255CC VAX-98 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 INPUT/OUTPUT 7FF255D0: 7FFE6440 EXIT $ Michael G. Mulligan Saddlebrook Corporation 101 Main Street Cambridge, MA 02142 Date: January 19, 1988 VAX-99 PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 System Improvement Request Submission Form System Improvement Request Submission Form Page 1 of _____ ________________________________________________________________ Submittor: Firm: Address: Phone: ________________________________________________________________ How to write an SIR: Describe the capability you would like to see available on VAX systems. Be as specific as possible. Please don't assume we know how it's done on the XYZ system. Justify why the capability would be useful and give an example of its use. If you wish, suggest a possible implementation of your request. ________________________________________________________________ Abstract (Please limit to four lines): ________________________________________________________________ Description and examples (use additional pages if required) PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 System Improvement Request Submission Form Tear out or photocopy reverse to submit an SIR Mark D. Oakley Battelle Columbus Division Room 11-6-008 505 King Avenue Columbus, Ohio 43201-2369 USA PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 VAX Systems SIG Spring 1988 SIR Ballot VAX Systems SIG Spring 1988 SIR Ballot DECUS membership number __________________ (six digits) Our site uses the following VAX cpus (check all that apply) 8700/8800 ___ 86nn ____ 85nn ____ 83nn/82nn ____ 11/780,11/782,11/785 ____ 11/750 ____ 11/730,11/725 ____ MicroVAX I,II ____ MicroVAX 2000 ____ MicroVAX 3n00 ____ We use VAXes in the following applications(Check all that apply) Business EDP ____ Software Development ____ Education ____ Computer Science Research ____ Data Acquisition/Control____ CAD/CAM ____ Service Bureau ____ Hardware Development ____ Scientific/Engineering ____ Office Automation ____ Telecommunications _____ Other __________________________ I support the following as the most important System Improvement Requests. (List from zero to fifteen SIR's): -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- I oppose the following SIR's as detrimental. (List from zero to five SIR's): -------- -------- -------- -------- -------- Mail to: Mark D. Oakley Battelle Columbus Division Room 11-6008 505 King Avenue Columbus, OH 43201-2693 USA To be counted, your ballot must be received by April 8. PAGESWAPPER - March 1988 - Volume 9 Number 8 VAX Systems SIG Spring 1988 SIR Ballot Tear out or photocopy reverse to vote on SIRs Mark D. Oakley Battelle Columbus Division Room 11-6008 505 King Avenue Columbus, Ohio 43201-2693 USA